Amazon asks court to halt Microsoft's work on Pentagon 'war cloud' • Hacker News Board

Re: Amazon asks court to halt Microsoft's work on Pentagon 'war cloud'

#21

Post by CrankyBear » Thu, Jan 23, 2020, 4:04 PM UTC

robbyt wrote: post #13

CrankyBear wrote: post #9

This is standard procedure in these kind of contract fights. I get so sick and tired of government IT contract squabbles. They drag on for years, little usually changes, and, in the meantime the work doesn't get done.

Sure, but in this case, the choice of Azure over AWS was due to government corruption, rather than actual technical diligence.

That's straight from AWS's U.S. Court of Federal Appeal case. This kind of claim is part of the standard government contract protest package. I'm not convinced.

Re: Amazon asks court to halt Microsoft's work on Pentagon 'war cloud'

#22

Post by toomuchtodo » Thu, Jan 23, 2020, 4:04 PM UTC

shadowgovt wrote: post #11

CrankyBear wrote: post #9

This is standard procedure in these kind of contract fights. I get so sick and tired of government IT contract squabbles. They drag on for years, little usually changes, and, in the meantime the work doesn't get done.

I'm not sure how standard procedure it is for the President to intervene in a down-the-chain contract decision though.

The question shouldn't be whether it's standard, but if the office has the authority to intervene. You can then work backwards to legislative hot fixes to governance deficiencies.

Re: Amazon asks court to halt Microsoft's work on Pentagon 'war cloud'

#23

Post by EpicEng » Thu, Jan 23, 2020, 4:06 PM UTC

robbyt wrote: post #13

CrankyBear wrote: post #9

This is standard procedure in these kind of contract fights. I get so sick and tired of government IT contract squabbles. They drag on for years, little usually changes, and, in the meantime the work doesn't get done.

Sure, but in this case, the choice of Azure over AWS was due to government corruption, rather than actual technical diligence.

You assume, and AWS claims. Luckily we have courts to decide what really happened.

Re: Amazon asks court to halt Microsoft's work on Pentagon 'war cloud'

#24

Post by wbl » Thu, Jan 23, 2020, 4:06 PM UTC

crazygringo wrote: post #19

Normally this might seem like a case of sore loser. But here's the thing: in government it's very important that contracts are awarded on objective merit, because otherwise there's shockingly large opportunity for corruption and favoritism. Billions and billions of dollars of opportunity. And also in this case, Trump's deep antipathy towards Bezos is well-documented, as well as his willingness to use government means…

When the process has costs exceeding the costs of the corruption there is a problem. Look at CA and how Tudor Perini still wins contracts despite a history of failure to deliver and bilking the taxpayer with change orders.

Re: Amazon asks court to halt Microsoft's work on Pentagon 'war cloud'

#25

Post by TallGuyShort » Thu, Jan 23, 2020, 4:06 PM UTC

toomuchtodo wrote: post #22

shadowgovt wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure how standard procedure it is for the President to intervene in a down-the-chain contract decision though.

The question shouldn't be whether it's standard, but if the office has the authority to intervene. You can then work backwards to legislative hot fixes to governance deficiencies.

Unfortunately, the question of how much authority the office has depends on which party currently occupies the office and who's asking.

Re: Amazon asks court to halt Microsoft's work on Pentagon 'war cloud'

#26

Post by hart_russell » Thu, Jan 23, 2020, 4:07 PM UTC

robbyt wrote: post #13

CrankyBear wrote: post #9

This is standard procedure in these kind of contract fights. I get so sick and tired of government IT contract squabbles. They drag on for years, little usually changes, and, in the meantime the work doesn't get done.

Sure, but in this case, the choice of Azure over AWS was due to government corruption, rather than actual technical diligence.

Now cite your sources...

Re: Amazon asks court to halt Microsoft's work on Pentagon 'war cloud'

#27

Post by kick » Thu, Jan 23, 2020, 4:07 PM UTC

This thread is kind of chilling, because everyone within is treating it like it's just chat software or something.

With quotes from this thread like "in the meantime the work doesn't get done," and "bid for contracts that [enable] government to make some real progress," you'd never guess this stuff is going to be used to and to enable murder.

So many people were focusing on how Microsoft Ɛ> Linux or Open Source or whatever (so much so that even rms went to Microsoft and complimented them) yet completely ignore the harm they're still trying to cause.

Re: Amazon asks court to halt Microsoft's work on Pentagon 'war cloud'

#28

Post by outside1234 » Thu, Jan 23, 2020, 4:08 PM UTC

crazygringo wrote: post #19

Normally this might seem like a case of sore loser. But here's the thing: in government it's very important that contracts are awarded on objective merit, because otherwise there's shockingly large opportunity for corruption and favoritism. Billions and billions of dollars of opportunity. And also in this case, Trump's deep antipathy towards Bezos is well-documented, as well as his willingness to use government means…

I mean, if you piss off a customer on a personal level, it should not surprise anyone if you lose the contract. This is reality the world wide.

Re: Amazon asks court to halt Microsoft's work on Pentagon 'war cloud'

#29

Post by freepor » Thu, Jan 23, 2020, 4:08 PM UTC

robbyt wrote: post #13

CrankyBear wrote: post #9

This is standard procedure in these kind of contract fights. I get so sick and tired of government IT contract squabbles. They drag on for years, little usually changes, and, in the meantime the work doesn't get done.

Sure, but in this case, the choice of Azure over AWS was due to government corruption, rather than actual technical diligence.

That is not yet proven. Azure has plenty of other business, so there exist reasons to select it other than corruption. If there wasn’t an openly corrupt president waging a public war with Jeff Bezos there wouldn’t even be the suspicion of this, but given the facts of the man I think Bezos is right to file suit and have it investigated.

Re: Amazon asks court to halt Microsoft's work on Pentagon 'war cloud'

#30

Post by toomuchtodo » Thu, Jan 23, 2020, 4:09 PM UTC

TallGuyShort wrote: post #25

toomuchtodo wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The question shouldn't be whether it's standard, but if the office has the authority to intervene. You can then work backwards to legislative hot fixes to governance deficiencies.

Unfortunately, the question of how much authority the office has depends on which party currently occupies the office and who's asking.

Which is why it's important to craft policy of strong checks and balances, regardless of which party has a majority. Today you're the Rebellion, tomorrow you're the Empire. Design systems resilient to subversion or tyranny by anyone.