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Tesla races past $100B in market valuation

reuters.com

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Re: Tesla races past $100B in market valuation

#331

Post by davidgould »

_ea1k wrote: post #146
gonehome wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This still sounds like the iPhone to me. A lot of other competitors will make android devices that are similar and eventually get a large market share, but the iPhone still dominates the higher end with better margins.

Indeed... its already happened with the Bolt. It beats the Model 3 on several objective practicality metrics. It is also slower and perceived as less attractive. Due to poor marketing, I suspect most perceive it to be much slower, rather than just somewhat slower. It sells really poorly. Most of these other competitors are going to run into the same fate for years.

I'm curious about "beats the Model 3 on several objective practicality metrics". Please elaborate, I'd like to know.

I considered the Bolt to replace my Honda Fit. I was on my second (first leased, second purchased) Chevy Spark EV. I'm committed to electric driving and I like small hatchbacks and have had a great experience with the Spark EV. The looks didn't bother me and I didn't want to spend a lot on a car either. I'm basically the perfect Bolt customer.

And yet, I every time I drive past a Bolt in my Model 3, I glad that I didn't make that mistake.

Re: Tesla races past $100B in market valuation

#332

Post by misiti3780 »

aynyc wrote: post #259
misiti3780 wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Im not saying your opinion is wrong, but most of the world cant afford a tesla, so I have no doubt that your friend group is skewed with salaries way above the mean.

I agree 100%, but most of the world won't buy Tesla stock. So the market for both the stock and the car are the same population. A lot of them owns BMW, Audi, Lexus. When many of them switch to Tesla, where do you think the stock will go?

fair point.

Re: Tesla races past $100B in market valuation

#333

Post by Consultant32452 »

xedeon wrote: post #312
Consultant32452 wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not an early adopter. I currently drive a Kia. I'm buying a cybertruck. Just thought I'd give an anecdote that's not switching from the luxury market.

The KIA EV's are actually not bad for the value. Alas, dealerships are very resistant in selling them. Which is a big shame. Another reason the direct from manufacturer approach works so well for Tesla.

I'm father away from Teslas than that. My Kia is not an EV and I've never bought a new car in my life, always used. Tesla is so compelling to me that I'm jumping from practically one end of the spectrum to the other.

Re: Tesla races past $100B in market valuation

#334

Post by jfengel »

charliemil4 wrote: post #230
donogh wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla is the Apple of the auto industry. They are getting stellar customer satisfaction ratings, which is translating into brand loyalty[1]. They've built an ecosystem between their above-average EV hardware, industry-leading software (with frequent improvements), and a top-notch charging network. I can see some automakers matching them on hardware, but they have a huge lead in software. Traditional car manufacturers…

On the surface, 'user experience' is a good starting point to align Tesla with Apple. However, I look at the underlying product / service being offered to see if their trajectories should strongly correlate, and when analyzing this way they have significant differences in addressing their core product - which means the Apple - Tesla narrative should not be the defacto response. Here's what I mean: Apple has always be…

Self-driving cars have the possibility to be transformational rather than evolutionary.

Self-driving cars mean you can get rid of on-street parking, freeing up a lot of travel lanes. They will speed up driving, since they have better reaction times and can communicate with each other to travel more closely. The time you do spend in a car can be more productive, effectively opening up whole new hours of your life. You can use them to move children around without having to drive them, opening up new educational opportunities. Ultimately tens of thousands of lives per year will be saved: humans are terrible drivers.

I don't really know what it will be like: transformational change is always unpredictable. Our entire physical infrastructure is built around driving, both in the cities and elsewhere, and changing the way we relate to our cars can radically alter the way we construct our lives. Maybe nothing will happen, but it's worth considering that this is a real technology that is getting very close and has enormous potential far beyond the "faster horse".

Re: Tesla races past $100B in market valuation

#335

Post by TomVDB »

londons_explore wrote: post #262
TomVDB wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WhatsApp is pretty popular, but Google Photos? The vast majority of people take a picture with the standard camera app and never look at the pictures again. You don’t need a non-native app for that.

Iphone doesn't let you search photos really - try searching for "photos of me skiing" or "igloo picture" and you'll soon find google photos is way ahead.

I just tried "igloo" in photos and it immediately showed the only picture of a snow fortress that I built with my kids 7 years ago. "skiing" also worked fine, as expected, but "Tom skiing" did not.

Since the first level implementation works fine, you're talking about a second level detail. Do you think this would nudge enough people towards using Google Photo to actually matter?

I very much doubt it.

Re: Tesla races past $100B in market valuation

#336

Post by davidgould »

oblio wrote: post #101
jrbuhl wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla payed a lot of money (billions) to build the super charger network. Money no government or other company seems to want to spend. Legislating away vendor lock-in would just cause companies to be even more averse to capital investment in recharging infrastructure.

I'm pretty sure gas station networks weren't built with public money. And other companies are investing in charger networks: https://ionity.eu/ or https://www.electrifyamerica.com/index At least in the EU I'm 99% sure that the EU will mandate (if it hasn't already) a standard charging interface. Don't know about the US, it's a bit like the Wild West in this regard...

Electrify America is mainly funded by VW as part of the Diesel-gate settlement. So not entirely voluntarily.

Re: Tesla races past $100B in market valuation

#337

Post by davidgould »

_ea1k wrote: post #299
xedeon wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure you understand how the BEV tax credit works. First of all, it's the customer that gets the refund NOT Tesla. Second, the buyer has to owe enough in liabilities to be even be eligible for it.

I absolutely do understand that. But there are economic principles at play here too. A $7,500 rebate is effectively a lower price without costing the manufacturer anything. While it is true that the buy has to meet the $7,500 threshold for that to work (which is not insignificant) for much of the lifespan of rebate availability, the cars were averaging >60k. Hopefully most people buying cars in that price range have…

It is now a hindrance as every other EV maker (except soon GM) gets the subsidy to compete against Tesla which no longer does.

Re: Tesla races past $100B in market valuation

#338

Post by davidgould »

mediaman wrote: post #225
ccheney wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla recently started billing $10/mo for internet service[1] (might be at a break-even price). They've also started to release in-app DLC ($2k) that makes your car accelerate quicker[2] [1] https://www.tesla.com/support/connectivity [2] https://electrek.co/2019/12/18/tesla-acceleration-boost-upgr...

Most of the major auto makers are trying to sell various tack-on services to get that ARR honey. Car-based internet is one of them. It's tough though: most people don't care about car based internet when their phone already has it. It doesn't feel like anyone has yet found a recurring revenue stream for vehicles that has met any actual demand.

I did not purchase the GM connectivity because it didn't provide any value, the features were lame or useless and it was no loss not having them after the trial period ended.

The Tesla connectivity is really part of the whole car experience and I would probably be willing to pay quite a bit more, I was surprised by how reasonable the price was.

Re: Tesla races past $100B in market valuation

#339

Post by cptskippy »

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #325
cptskippy wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That doesn't seem entirely accurate. How so? Super Cruise requires that the car's forward collision avoidance, and adaptive cruise control technologies be enabled. It utilizes pre-scanned high precision LIDAR and GPS derived maps that limit where it can travel, and is 100% reliant on GPS to maintain it's lane. It cannot change lanes or steer around navigate traffic. It won't function in exit lanes. It won't functio…

>Does all of that sophistication in Tesla's system perform better? Eh... it's debatable. But it's definitely more sophisticated and is absolutely doing more advanced things... I think you have a different definition of advanced and sophisticated than I do. If I do fizzbuzz with a neural network is it really more advanced and sophisticated?

> I think you have a different definition of advanced and sophisticated than I do.

What are your definitions of advanced and sophisticated?

Advanced : being beyond the elementary or introductory - https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/advanced

Sophisticated : highly complicated or developed - https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sophisticated

> If I do fizzbuzz with a neural network is it really more advanced and sophisticated?

Yes but that doesn't mean it's better.

Re: Tesla races past $100B in market valuation

#340

Post by gonehome »

davidgould wrote: post #331
_ea1k wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed... its already happened with the Bolt. It beats the Model 3 on several objective practicality metrics. It is also slower and perceived as less attractive. Due to poor marketing, I suspect most perceive it to be much slower, rather than just somewhat slower. It sells really poorly. Most of these other competitors are going to run into the same fate for years.

I'm curious about "beats the Model 3 on several objective practicality metrics". Please elaborate, I'd like to know. I considered the Bolt to replace my Honda Fit. I was on my second (first leased, second purchased) Chevy Spark EV. I'm committed to electric driving and I like small hatchbacks and have had a great experience with the Spark EV. The looks didn't bother me and I didn't want to spend a lot on a car either…

Yeah I'd also be curious - the Model 3 seems to be categorically better in every way?

I'd even go so far as to say the Model 3 is the best car Tesla makes, I think it's a lot better than the X (I think the falcon wing doors are actually a pain in practice and the bucket seat arrangement in the back doesn't leave much space for practical use).

The S is nice, but pretty large and I prefer the interior (and door handles) of the 3. I think the 3 also drives more like a sports car because of its smaller size. I don't think there is anything on the market at any price point that I'd prefer day to day.

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