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U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

reuters.com

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Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#241

Post by jhloa2 »

Marsymars wrote: post #238
nate_meurer wrote: post #214

Meanwhile, these same PFAS chemicals are sprayed liberally onto the surface of clothing that we all wear, and increasingly furniture as well, and this may account for far more human PFAS consumption than drinking water. PFAS chemicals are widely used for waterproofing fabrics. The industry term is DWR -- Durable Water Repellent. The chemicals are sprayed onto the surface and simply left there to rub off on your hands…

> As of 2019, only one large outdoor clothing company has abandoned PFC-based DWR finishes. Which one?

I was under the assumption that Patagonia was PFC free but according to their website: "Patagonia has long relied on a DWR with perfluorinated compound (PFC) but we have been searching diligently for an alternative because of its harmful environmental impacts."

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#242

Post by smitty1110 »

abandonliberty wrote: post #231
troyvit wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow I had no idea. Here's a link that talks about makers of outdoor gear and their relationship with DWR. http://www.detox-outdoor.org/ It doesn't look like there is a lot of choice. Maybe I'll just stay wet :)

That site isn't loading for me. I would hope that vapor-permeable membranes work (e.g. gore-tex). The only problem is that the outside of the garment gets wet, and they're not very breathable

Gore-tex is PTFE, also known as Teflon, which is a flurocarbon. Several of the waste products or reactants for making Teflon are in the same category as DWR products, and are basically toxic forever. There's not much you can do if you need fabrics with these properties, you just need to pick you poison.

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#243

Post by [deleted] »

Marsymars wrote: post #238
nate_meurer wrote: post #214

Meanwhile, these same PFAS chemicals are sprayed liberally onto the surface of clothing that we all wear, and increasingly furniture as well, and this may account for far more human PFAS consumption than drinking water. PFAS chemicals are widely used for waterproofing fabrics. The industry term is DWR -- Durable Water Repellent. The chemicals are sprayed onto the surface and simply left there to rub off on your hands…

> As of 2019, only one large outdoor clothing company has abandoned PFC-based DWR finishes. Which one?

[deleted]

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#244

Post by rayiner »

shmerl wrote: post #240
nate_meurer wrote: post #214

Meanwhile, these same PFAS chemicals are sprayed liberally onto the surface of clothing that we all wear, and increasingly furniture as well, and this may account for far more human PFAS consumption than drinking water. PFAS chemicals are widely used for waterproofing fabrics. The industry term is DWR -- Durable Water Repellent. The chemicals are sprayed onto the surface and simply left there to rub off on your hands…

Why can't they be made illegal to use?

Because we have no idea whether the benefit from doing so would outweigh the loss of non-stick and stain-free products?

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#245

Post by trophycase »

rukittenme wrote: post #158
nck4222 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Democracy is mostly a facade in the US anyway. But I agree, the US government isn't functioning 1) as originally intended or 2) for the benefit of the majority of the people it 'represents.' Although it's worth noting that 'as the forefathers intended' carries more weight than it typically should. Their intentions were mostly based on philosophical guess work, as they didn't have a whole lot of empirical data or exi…

> the US government isn't functioning for the benefit of the majority of the people it 'represents.' American democracy was never meant to benefit just the majority. Which is why we have undemocratic institutions (such as the Judiciary). Minorities (both long-standing and ephemeral -- e.g. a race of people versus the losing party in an election) exist and should be protected from the majority and should be represente…

"The fact that power swings from Republicans, back to Democrats, back to Republicans, and so on, illustrates that there is a very weak majority in this country and no consensus opinion on how to move forward."

I think it better illustrates how really these parties are mostly the same. As AOC said, the Democratic party is a center conservative party for the most part. Biden and Trump are a lot more similar than people would like to admit. Just look at Biden's comments about video games and you can see how much of a reactionary conservative he actually is.

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#246

Post by bjornjajajaja »

troyvit wrote: post #225
nate_meurer wrote: post #214

Meanwhile, these same PFAS chemicals are sprayed liberally onto the surface of clothing that we all wear, and increasingly furniture as well, and this may account for far more human PFAS consumption than drinking water. PFAS chemicals are widely used for waterproofing fabrics. The industry term is DWR -- Durable Water Repellent. The chemicals are sprayed onto the surface and simply left there to rub off on your hands…

Wow I had no idea. Here's a link that talks about makers of outdoor gear and their relationship with DWR. http://www.detox-outdoor.org/ It doesn't look like there is a lot of choice. Maybe I'll just stay wet :)

Honestly people have “stayed wet“ for centuries without chemicals. We’ve hung our clothes to dry instead of using machines too.

Lots of apparel products are highly overrated. And those water resistant coatings just come off anyway.

I think the best thing to do is go on a hike near a river with a dog, and watch how the dog marches through the water unwaveringly even when it’s cold!

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#247

Post by samename »

0xB31B1B wrote: post #188
chongli wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think democracy was always problematic. Its original form, direct democracy, was vulnerable to the tyranny of the masses. Representative democracy, long described as the solution, really isn’t. Representatives are self-interested, just like everyone else, and so we cannot expect them to be purely faithful executors of their respective mandates. What we did not expect, and perhaps are now beginning to, is that human…

To be fair, this issue was much debated at the creation of democratic rule in Greece. Their solution to the problem of ambition and resource guarding is “sortition”, which is a lottery in which a large fraction of the democratic body is chosen by chance rather than by popular election, skill or ambition. This was meant to be a check on the development of the type of permanent ruling oligarchy we see developing in the…

Is the sortition method effective at combating this problem?

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#248

Post by shmerl »

rayiner wrote: post #244
shmerl wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why can't they be made illegal to use?

Because we have no idea whether the benefit from doing so would outweigh the loss of non-stick and stain-free products?

That's supposed to be a joke?

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#249

Post by mnm1 »

papito wrote: post #234
matthewdgreen wrote: post #48

It is constantly amazing to me that "cover up the existence of poisonous chemicals in your drinking water" is a viable position for a democratically-elected officeholder to have. What a world we live in.

I don't know. I've always scoffed at the Socialist paradise of Western Europe, but I've changed my mind after traveling to Denmark a few months ago. The government employs a lot of people, and they seem to make sure that they themselves work for the public good. The public . You know, people who all live in the country. Everything is clean and the trains are on time. Let's not bundle everyone under "Democracy". Our s…

Why should we have to force socialize people in a context of killing others? We force socialize people in plenty of other contexts like 12 years of schooling, most of which is mandatory. That hasn't gotten people to play in a team. Why would six weeks be any different? The only thing that will come out of mandatory boot camp is resentment and hate towards the government, institutions, and people that demand it.

My parents and other relatives of their generation grew up in the type of culture you describe. They risked their lives and risked torture to run away from it. The six months of boot camp certainly didn't make the society more cohesive or the make the people trust each other. No one wanted to be there and people were still afraid of themselves, the police, and the government. If it wasn't on a different continent, in a different era, I'd think I'm talking about the US. Needless to say, forcing people to socialize against their will does not lead to social cohesion or patriotism. It leads to resentment. Especially when you force it on people who think that patriotism really is for scoundrels.

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#250

Post by selimthegrim »

rayiner wrote: post #224
matthewdgreen wrote: post #48

It is constantly amazing to me that "cover up the existence of poisonous chemicals in your drinking water" is a viable position for a democratically-elected officeholder to have. What a world we live in.

Maintaining the status quo is an incredibly valuable position for democratically elected politicians to have. Joe Biden’s entire campaign is built on “I won’t change anything except spruce up the ACA a bit.” Representative democracy involves various groups focusing attention on one issue or the other. When it comes to things like drinking water or food, people’s fear of “impure” food can cause public panic vastly out…

This isn’t true when you look at the manufacturing sites in WV.
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