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Glenn Greenwald Charged with Cybercrimes in Brazil

nytimes.com

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Re: Glenn Greenwald Charged with Cybercrimes in Brazil

#81

Post by airstrike »

crazynick4 wrote: post #42
diegoholiveira wrote: post #36

It's important to notice that he's not been charged for publishing those materials. He's been charged for giving instructions to the hackers about targets and contents, like a lider of the hackers. So, it's not a leak, it's a content obtained illegally through a series of crimes.

This is something journalists do all the time. If a source comes to you, even with illegally obtained materials, it is normal for a journalist to ask for more, that's their job.

You're making a moral argument, not a legal one.

People doing something "all the time" in one jurisdiction doesn't magically make it legal in a different one.

Re: Glenn Greenwald Charged with Cybercrimes in Brazil

#82

Post by ilikehurdles »

mistermann wrote: post #72
aaronbrethorst wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not. Investigators ultimately had an incomplete picture of what happened due to communications that were encrypted, deleted or unsaved, as well as testimony that was false, incomplete or declined. However, the report stated that Russian interference in the 2016 presidential election was illegal and occurred "in sweeping and systematic fashion", but was welcomed by the Trump campaign as it expected to benefit fro…

Am I the only one that believes that such narrative and speculative writing style by officials is actively harmful to democracy? Phrases like: - in sweeping and systematic fashion - was welcomed by the Trump campaign - links between - ties to - connected to Granted, communicating the complexities of reality is very difficult, but I sincerely do not believe that a serious effort has been made in this case (or is in ot…

Your intuition is correct. This is not accidental. Those phrases are used because certain things are known with a high degree of certainty. Meetings between Trump campaign members and Natalia Veselnitskaya's group lend credence to those phrases[1]. There is a significant evidence documenting Russian Interference (consider the IRA involvement alone) and the links between the Trump campaign and Russians[2], some of which fell within the investigative scope of Mueller's team.

A nuanced report that concluded the existence of foreign interference, of campaign links to that foreign interference, and also of not significant enough evidence to conclude coordination between the two groups is going to include a lot of nuance in the phrasing of its conclusion.

[1]:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_Tower_meeting

[2]:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Russian_interferen...

Re: Glenn Greenwald Charged with Cybercrimes in Brazil

#83

Post by equalunique »

onecool wrote: post #79
SlowRobotAhead wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IIRC the DNC was using Crowstrike for their AV and security who interestingly has a lot of their company based in Ukraine, and both CS and DNC refused to allow the FBI access to servers and logs to verify the Russian attack. IDK much about much, but that sure does seem questionable to me.

The Crowdstrike line is another primary talking point of the paid Russian propagandists.

A talking point belonging to a group one dislikes does not make it invalid.

Re: Glenn Greenwald Charged with Cybercrimes in Brazil

#84

Post by airstrike »

Before commenting, let's all pause for a minute and recognize that:

(a) we're not versed in Brazilian Law

(b) we don't really have all the facts of the case

(c) "charged with" and "found guilty of" are vastly different things

(d) one's opinion on the morality of a certain alleged episode has no bearing on its legality

Re: Glenn Greenwald Charged with Cybercrimes in Brazil

#85

Post by piadodjanho »

jariel wrote: post #77
crazynick4 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is something journalists do all the time. If a source comes to you, even with illegally obtained materials, it is normal for a journalist to ask for more, that's their job.

Was it 'asking for more' or 'helping' with said activities? I think there is materially a difference. That said, I don't know the specifics of the case, I'd be interested in hearing if there is material legitimacy to the case. If they are jailing a reporter for essentially publishing data and merely 'communicating' with individuals ... this would be bad. Also - there is the question of the legitimacy of publishing ha…

I just read the part of accusation that was used to indicted Gleen Greenwald. There is no proof of collusion with the hacker. Actually in his communication with the hackers, he was very cautious . Also, the Supreme court had decided GG couldn't be investigated when he start publishing the conversations.

> If someone hacked into your phone, and published it, it would be a crime. If they gave it to a journalist, not a crime?

The hacking is a crime, the publishing isn't. But once you start giving direction to the hacker, you became the hacker accomplice.

> If there is uncovering of actual, illegal activities, then it changes the dynamic, but what if it's not? What if the 'details' are just embarrassing, or problematic for those hacked? Do we want to legitimise theft for political objectives?

That's whats happened in Brazil. There published communication didn't show any _unquestionably_ illegal activity. Even if did, the brazillian law don't allow to use illegally obtained proofs (unless if absolves someone).

Re: Glenn Greenwald Charged with Cybercrimes in Brazil

#86

Post by kofejnik »

crazynick4 wrote: post #42
diegoholiveira wrote: post #36

It's important to notice that he's not been charged for publishing those materials. He's been charged for giving instructions to the hackers about targets and contents, like a lider of the hackers. So, it's not a leak, it's a content obtained illegally through a series of crimes.

This is something journalists do all the time. If a source comes to you, even with illegally obtained materials, it is normal for a journalist to ask for more, that's their job.

> Mr. Greenwald encouraged the hackers to delete archives that had already been shared with The Intercept Brasil, in order to cover their tracks.

so he was an active participant, according to prosecution

Re: Glenn Greenwald Charged with Cybercrimes in Brazil

#87

Post by mzs »

crazynick4 wrote: post #42
diegoholiveira wrote: post #36

It's important to notice that he's not been charged for publishing those materials. He's been charged for giving instructions to the hackers about targets and contents, like a lider of the hackers. So, it's not a leak, it's a content obtained illegally through a series of crimes.

This is something journalists do all the time. If a source comes to you, even with illegally obtained materials, it is normal for a journalist to ask for more, that's their job.

But in this case it is alleged Greenwald encouraged his source to commit a further crime, "Mr. Greenwald encouraged the hackers to delete archives that had already been shared with The Intercept Brasil, in order to cover their tracks."

Re: Glenn Greenwald Charged with Cybercrimes in Brazil

#88

Post by AndrewBissell »

giacaglia wrote: post #35
AndrewBissell wrote: post #2

It's funny to contrast Greenwald's situation with that of people in the US press who hate his guts, all while they bemoan the Trump admin's threats to press freedom. This is what happens to journalists who actually speak truth to power, rather than flatter it while indulging in a bunch of self-congratulatory theater.

The fact is that he worked direct with the hackers to hack government information. He is gonna go through the judicial system as everyone does

"Everyone"

Yes, we all remember when the CIA officers responsible for the torture program were prosecuted, or when James Clapper was indicted for lying to Congress, or when the Boeing executives who knowingly sold a plane with safety flaws were brought up on criminal charges. Imagine the threat to the rule of law if we allowed offenders like Greenwald to go unpunished!

Re: Glenn Greenwald Charged with Cybercrimes in Brazil

#89

Post by lubesGordi »

crazynick4 wrote: post #42
diegoholiveira wrote: post #36

It's important to notice that he's not been charged for publishing those materials. He's been charged for giving instructions to the hackers about targets and contents, like a lider of the hackers. So, it's not a leak, it's a content obtained illegally through a series of crimes.

This is something journalists do all the time. If a source comes to you, even with illegally obtained materials, it is normal for a journalist to ask for more, that's their job.

This is true, and it even says in the article that Brazil protects journalists even if their source materials are obtained illegally.

Re: Glenn Greenwald Charged with Cybercrimes in Brazil

#90

Post by coolspot »

freepor wrote: post #3

Oof. I don’t know why he would stay in Brazil while publishing stuff that embarrassed powerful interests in Brazil. You can do that shit in Canada, in Brazil you’re lucky to not get a bullet.

Surprised to see this comment downvoted.

Journalists (and basically anyone against those in power) are killed routinely in Brazil. It's not even a big deal in these countries. [1]

[1] - https://cpj.org/americas/brazil/

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