Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after FBI complained • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after FBI complained

#241

Post by dfee » Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 5:17 PM UTC

neya wrote: post #228

justapassenger wrote: post #191

Wonder if this will help to kill a meme, about how much Apple cares about users and what great values they have, how they're going to stand for the user, fight with governments, etc. While iPhone itself is pretty secure as a device phone (and Apple makes sure to remind you about that in each ad, public speaking, attacks on competitors, etc), as an ecosystem it's not secure. And it's like that on purpose - there's no…

>While iPhone itself is pretty secure as a device phone I simply don't understand why people would blindly believe marketing material from a for-profit corporation. It's a device running closed source software. There is no way to prove this claim. If anything, Apple has been caught in the past sending very very personal sensitive information [1]. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/jul/26/apple-con...

Why the distinction on for-profit? There are plenty of non-profits you shouldn’t trust.

Surely their tax status is orthogonal to their trustability.

Re: Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after FBI complained

#242

Post by sprite » Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 5:17 PM UTC

mrtksn wrote: post #57

Apple has a list for that: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202303 These are end to end: Home data Health data (requires iOS 12 or later) iCloud Keychain (includes all of your saved accounts and passwords) Payment information QuickType Keyboard learned vocabulary (requires iOS 11 or later) Screen Time Siri information Wi-Fi passwords The messages also end to end but the backup contains the private key. The moral of…

One thing to keep in mind with iMessage. Even if you back up locally the receiving party is probably using iCloud. So not sure how much it will really help.

Re: Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after FBI complained

#243

Post by ogre_codes » Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 5:19 PM UTC

GeekyBear wrote: post #207

>there's no good and easy option to backup your phone other than iCloud. Turn off iCloud and do local encrypted backups to your PC or Mac. This works over your wifi network (if you prefer wireless charging at home) or via a cable connection.

Pretty much this. It's a bit of a PITA, but an easy work around.

Of course then you have a local backup on a hard drive which is itself subject to seizure and I believe even encrypted backups can be cracked.

Re: Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after FBI complained

#244

Post by wheelie_boy » Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 5:21 PM UTC

slimginz wrote: post #205

chias wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In fairness, the title does not say that Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups because FBI complained :P

I know you're being cheeky and pedantic, but that's exactly the spin the title was trying to go for in order to get clicks. While not "technically" wrong, it's still pretty dishonest imo.

"Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after release of 'National Treasure 2', starring Nicholas Cage"

Re: Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after FBI complained

#245

Post by simonh » Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 5:22 PM UTC

justapassenger wrote: post #227

GeekyBear wrote: post #207

>there's no good and easy option to backup your phone other than iCloud. Turn off iCloud and do local encrypted backups to your PC or Mac. This works over your wifi network (if you prefer wireless charging at home) or via a cable connection.

It’s not only way more friction than iCloud, but you’d be surprised how many people nowadays don’t even own a PC or Mac. In my wife’s family 60% of people only have phones, tablets and smart TVs. They use laptops/desktops only at work.

It's a shame, but I don't see how this is a knock against Apple. They offer a basic service to backup your device on their infrastructure. If you want better/more you have to provide the infrastructure yourself, and they support several common permutations of suitable infrastructure. I think that's reasonable.

Re: Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after FBI complained

#246

Post by anoncake » Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 5:22 PM UTC

_bxg1 wrote: post #206

> aboyt how much Apple cares about users No company cares about anything. A company is not a person. Apple, because of its privacy-marketing, is incentivized to be the privacy player in the market. But only so far as consumers keep them honest about it. They got away with this loophole because it stayed under the radar; if it gets enough attention and enough customers show that it matters to them, it could change. On…

A company does care about things in that it has objectives.

Re: Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after FBI complained

#247

Post by damnyou » Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 5:22 PM UTC

proidgeree1 wrote: post #103

andreasley wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While Apple doesn't force its users to use iCloud, they also don't provide an alternative way to do full backups of iOS/iPadOS devices over a network. Yes, you can plug an iPhone into a Mac, but that doesn't scale.

You can set local auto backup over wifi in itunes right?

If you have a computer available that can run iTunes, sure.

Re: Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after FBI complained

#248

Post by bazza451 » Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 5:24 PM UTC

clowd wrote: post #194

clarkmoody wrote: post #73

Beyond HN and tech circles, is there any detectable groundswell of demand for privacy? When you talk with friends & family about privacy, does anyone care? When average people care about privacy, the large players will respond. Until then, pressure from the state can be accommodated without irking customers, so Big Tech will play along.

Next time you encounter someone who claims they don't care about privacy, ask whether or not they close the bathroom door (or the stall in a public restroom) when they're taking a shit. And if they say yes, ask them why? What's going on in there isn't any big secret. It's not like they're in there plotting a terrorist attack. What are they hiding behind that door? It turns out most people _do_ care about privacy. You…

Great post!

Re: Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after FBI complained

#249

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 5:25 PM UTC

justapassenger wrote: post #227

GeekyBear wrote: post #207

>there's no good and easy option to backup your phone other than iCloud. Turn off iCloud and do local encrypted backups to your PC or Mac. This works over your wifi network (if you prefer wireless charging at home) or via a cable connection.

It’s not only way more friction than iCloud, but you’d be surprised how many people nowadays don’t even own a PC or Mac. In my wife’s family 60% of people only have phones, tablets and smart TVs. They use laptops/desktops only at work.

[deleted]

Re: Apple dropped plan for encrypting backups after FBI complained

#250

Post by tcookisfakeaf » Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 5:25 PM UTC

justapassenger wrote: post #191

Wonder if this will help to kill a meme, about how much Apple cares about users and what great values they have, how they're going to stand for the user, fight with governments, etc. While iPhone itself is pretty secure as a device phone (and Apple makes sure to remind you about that in each ad, public speaking, attacks on competitors, etc), as an ecosystem it's not secure. And it's like that on purpose - there's no…

In the last year Tim Cook has told college grads his generation failed them on the environment, and Apple complained in the EU about being forced to adopt one standard connector for devices.

Lawyers rule the world. Our romantic ideas of law as a just human social framework has always been nonsense. It’s to shield the elite from us.

They were designed in an Us v. Them mentality: https://politics.stackexchange.com/questions/8793/what-did-j...

Tim is all, “Sad news kids. My peers and I applied our agency to tasks that made this huge mess. Despite acknowledging this, gonna stick with it. Cause I got fewer years ahead of me than you! Cheers!”