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Microsoft just bought Nokia for $0

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141–150 of 160 posts

Re: Microsoft just bought Nokia for $0

#141
post #74
post #65

Why is this on the front page? Come on. Anyone who thinks this deal isn't good for both parties is kidding themselves. After years of trying to create their own operating system Nokia have finally admitted they need to invest in an ecosystem. If they were to take on Android they'd be late to an already full party. With WP7 there's no one seriously pushing it, Dell, LG both aren't famous for their phones. HTC owes mos…

Plus Nokia certainly negotiated a great deal. If they get WP7 licenses for 1$ when others get it for 10$, they have room to provide better quality for the same retail price, while making comfortable margins. It's not because Apple develops its own OS that this strategy is the best for everyone. Nokia should better be the next Dell than the next Amiga. Also, carriers can't break WP7 like they can break Android (and bl…

But is that legal?

Even if it's legal, the other manufacturers will just abandon Windows Mobile 7. Not a nice scene.

Re: Microsoft just bought Nokia for $0

#142
post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Compared to what? Compared to joining an ecosystem that has already succeeded (Android). The downside if WP7 turns out to peak at 5% of the market - which is entirely possible at this juncture - is that Nokia will suffer a horrific drop in profits and probably go out of business. They now need WP7 to reach 30 - 50% of the market simply to consider this strategy a success. It's incredibly risky to take a bet like that…

And it is entirely possible. Remember, Nokia has a huge hold of lower/middle-end mobile market. If they can manage to get WP7 on devices in that segment without making them much more expensive, WP7 might just as well become a respectable competitor.

Remember that the burning platform memo was specific.. Not only are they losing on the top end -- there's phones coming out of China now beating them on the bottom end.

Re: Microsoft just bought Nokia for $0

#143
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plus Nokia certainly negotiated a great deal. If they get WP7 licenses for 1$ when others get it for 10$, they have room to provide better quality for the same retail price, while making comfortable margins. It's not because Apple develops its own OS that this strategy is the best for everyone. Nokia should better be the next Dell than the next Amiga. Also, carriers can't break WP7 like they can break Android (and bl…

But is that legal? Even if it's legal, the other manufacturers will just abandon Windows Mobile 7. Not a nice scene.

I think it would be just like giving a discount to bulk orders. Nokia will buy a huge amount of licenses compared to dell, htc or any other supplier. Once the app ecosystem grows other suppliers will want to be a part of it.

Re: Microsoft just bought Nokia for $0

#144
This is a ridiculously bad article that glorifies Nokia as something they haven't been in many years. It was sink or swim time for them. Choosing Android 2 years ago may have been a really smart move but there are already established leaders in Android handsets. It was too late for Nokia to go anywhere with Android. They will be a first class citizen of WM7 and get a tremendous amount of support from Microsoft who will be willing to piss away millions, if not billions, of dollars to promote WM7. They could have never got that type of treatment from Google. They'd be just another player in an overcrowded market. At least this gives them some potential to offer a unique product.

Re: Microsoft just bought Nokia for $0

#145
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Partnerships with Microsoft very rarely work out to the other business' advantage, unless it was their goal all along to be acquired by MS or be nothing more than a commodity hardware vendor. We'll know this is the case if Nokia announces "the new Nokia Online Superstore where you get all your WindowsTM-compatible accessories at discount prices".

Microsoft has not "bought" Nokia, it's just merely a cooperation between the two companies...don't see the hazzle about all this really

But without controlling their software, Nokia's almost entirely surrendered control over their product direction to Microsoft. Contrast it to Apple, where having their own hardware and software lets them do things like the retina display upgrade. In Nokia's case, MS says "This is what the OS is capable of," and Nokia has no choice other than "Ok, we'll make a touchscreen with some buttons that comply with your interface conventions."

They're going from a mobile phone company to a widget manufacturer. It's a position not very different from where Dell, Gateway, HP, etc have been in control of product design, but unable to innovate in ways that would really improve the customer experience. So they're relegated to hardware design (within some pretty narrow constraints) and differentiating their computers by loading some shitty bloatware on and saying " doesn't have a dock on all four screen edges like we do!"

There's still money to be made in the hardware business, but it's not something I'd aspire to were I in the cellular industry. It's better than being put out of business, but Microsoft's lack of direction in OS design is likely to hobble them as they try to compete with Apple's ecosystem. I mean, WM7 tried to copy iOS 1 and say "Nah, you don't need copy/paste". Apple's continued to make progress toward a capable mobile OS, and MS still hasn't fixed it. Do you see them having a good chance at competing in the long run?

My prediction: Nokia and WM7 won't be able to compete on features or design, so they'll compete on price. As the smartphone market portion continues to grow, a lot of it will be on the bottom end, with people moving from crappy featurephones to crappy smartphones. If they can find a market niche, it'll be the people who just say "I want a phone," and not anybody who knows or cares any more than that. Which is a pretty big market to be calling a "niche," but it's got slim profit margins. Maybe they can make up for it in volume.

Re: Microsoft just bought Nokia for $0

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why I bought an iPhone; even though I'll never buy a Macbook or other Apple products. Being able to sync contacts / calendar back and forth to my Google Apps account is priceless.

The Windows Phone does this. It also integrates those contacts with the status updates, contact details and pictures from your Facebook, Hotmail, YMail & Exchange accounts

From everything I've read, WP7 is really good. However, I think that it's a huge fault of Microsoft that it just hasn't been marketed well. I've wanted to try one... I go to Best Buy, and all they have is one non-functional demo unit (the kind with just a picture of a screenshot). Can you ever imagine Apple launching an iPhone, and not having working versions of it in their store to try out?

I'm skeptical, but hopefully Nokia will give them enough exposure and allow people to actually get their hands on a WP7 phone.

Re: Microsoft just bought Nokia for $0

#147
post #2

I think the "the same happen without any risk to MS" is an excellent point - the downside for Microsoft is limited and the upside is pretty good. For Nokia the upside is limited (at best you are yet-another Windows Mobile 7 handset manufacturer - it's not like they have an exclusive) and the downside is huge.

"The downside is huge." Compared to what? I don't think the downside is greater than the downside of maintaining their own incredibly expensive and increasingly obsolete platform(s). This gives them their only hope of delivering a stable smartphones with a modern UI in the first half of this year (bonus: without spending tens-of-thousands of developer hours). I consider that "upside".

eh, tens of thousands of developer hours is pretty small potatoes to Nokia. consider 2000 hours a year, give or take, per developer.

Consider that nokia just completely alienated all of their external developers, and likely most of their internal software people.

Even if the windows mobile 7 turns out to be reasonably good, they've just thrown away the software half of their organization. It's gone. If windows 7 doesn't work out for them a year from now? they will have to start over from scratch. Developer goodwill? gone. Developer mindshare? gone. those are some pretty valuable things they just threw away.

Personally, I think their shareholders would have been a whole lot better off if they had sold to microsoft outright.

Re: Microsoft just bought Nokia for $0

#148
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Re: Microsoft just bought Nokia for $0

#149
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why I bought an iPhone; even though I'll never buy a Macbook or other Apple products. Being able to sync contacts / calendar back and forth to my Google Apps account is priceless.

Works fine with android or WebOs too. What's the point?

Second sentence is unrelated to the first one; I was in a hurry.

My wife has an LG Optimus One (e.g. cheap Android). It's really nice for the price paid, but she has had problems with it.

I tried to say that the iPhone provides the best experience (out of the box at least), and if you want an Android, you should check out the ratings on that product because quality varies.

Re: Microsoft just bought Nokia for $0

#150
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you elaborate on that please ? Personally I fail to see in what this choice is better, maybe I missed something.

Given WP7's pretty disappointing launch so far, Nokia is customer #1 at MS. They can dictate the direction of the platform, and as the de facto (and one of the only ) WP7 OEMs, the WP7 user experience will become synonymous with the Nokia user experience. They are in essence taking HTC's place back in the old Windows Mobile days - as one of the only actual supporters of the platform, they got front-row seats. On Andr…

The jury is still out but the general sentiment seems to be that Android is better software than WP7 and as you insinuated the "hordes of Android phones out there" aren't particularly well built, certainly not to the level of the iPhone. If Nokia is as good at hardware as they are being given credit for wouldn't they want to build premier hardware for the Android platform? It's not like MS will not license WP7 to all the other OEMs that are on Android right now and I haven't seen much evidence that Nokia is actually good at UX so it's unclear what they could add to WP7 that would be of so much value. After all "taking HTC's place back in the old Windows Mobile days" seems like a pretty scary image of the future.

If all they do really well is hardware, and both platforms are available to all OEMs, why not go for the more successful one, especially considering that WP7 is proprietary so MS can decide to play hardball with them at any point.

My own opinion of Nokia is that their classic line of phones had by far the best software, and while initially it had better hardware, that lead narrowed considerably pretty quickly. Yet that software was very good because it was an extremely feature limited and highly resilient phone OS. Nothing modern is as good at being a cellphone as a classic Nokia. And as the iPhone conclusively demonstrated, that doesn't matter these days. Symbian was a disaster and Meego seems promising but behind. They really lost a great catch in Palm, and I'm not really sure they'll be able to differentiate themselves as a hardware builder on any platform for that matter.

My weekend coach suggestion would be to take a leaf from the iPhone playbook and release only one phone every year or more, that has the best possible industrial design you can muster and that gets timely updates to a vanilla version of Android, properly tested and integrated. If you want a low-end model just tweak the previous year's high-end model and sell it cheaper (think PSOne).

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