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What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

payup.wtf

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Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#381

Post by sokoloff »

onion2k wrote: post #262
sokoloff wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Turning paying customers away for what is (to them) arbitrary and unpredictable reasons is a recipe for your service being perceived as unreliable. “I’m hungry; I’d like to give Doordash some money.” “Computer says no.” “Damn; can’t trust Doordash.”

This is a fairly simple problem to manage though. The computer shouldn't say "no", it should say "This trip isn't fair on our drivers because the standard fee doesn't cover the costs. Would you like to pay the extended distance fee or cancel this job?" It'd still put some people off, but fewer than you'd think. A lot of people want to be ethical when they're buying things.

An extended distance fee being proposed when I live the same distance from the restaurant as the last time I ordered and didn't get charged the fee feels like you're not doing your job in "handling things" for me.

People outsource tasks in part because they don't want to think about the details. Where do UPS trucks get their fuel? Do they use diesel or gas? How long between oil changes? Do the drivers get cold in the truck? Where do Door Dash drivers use the bathroom while they're working? Is the grocery store losing money on those end cap bargains? How does the electrician figure out how to not get shocked? How does the plumber solder pipes without burning my house down? How do roofers stay safe while installing their safety anchors? How long do painters' paint brushes last?

I don't want to think about any of that; I just want to have a reliable service provided with the details handled for me. Every bit of friction you put into the system with fuel surcharges, baggage fees, resort fees, blackout dates, surge pricing, weekend surcharges, and the like represents both financial and attention loss to me in terms of the value you are providing. (At least surge pricing, weekend call-out surcharges, and blackout dates I can understand as maybe essential to giving an attractive overall proposition.)

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#382

Post by Nextgrid »

asah wrote: post #361
sschueller wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We can, stop using and supporting these predatory companies. Never use Uber, Lyft, Doordash, Uber Eats, AirBnB etc. No exception irregardless how easy or cheap it may be. It's a small sacrifice but can and will make a difference. Using these services to me is like asking a waiter to pay for part of my meal. When it comes around to paying the bill are you able to face someone and ask them to pay for part of what they…

We can, but.. - incumbent taxis are also predatory services that abuse drivers, arguably worse than Uber/Lyft - and they're a shitty rider experience in many many ways. - hotels are OK but rarely provide kitchens, let alone friendly hosts who bake you killer banana bread (yesterday's stay) - delivery from individual restaurants is rarely available at all, and thus you're going to call a Postmates/etc to help pickup.…

> delivery from individual restaurants is rarely available at all

You can thank the likes of Uber Eats, Deliveroo, etc. A lot of restaurants would've otherwise had their own service, and some actually replaced their own service with these companies.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#383

Post by Nextgrid »

ace32229 wrote: post #234
sschueller wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We can, stop using and supporting these predatory companies. Never use Uber, Lyft, Doordash, Uber Eats, AirBnB etc. No exception irregardless how easy or cheap it may be. It's a small sacrifice but can and will make a difference. Using these services to me is like asking a waiter to pay for part of my meal. When it comes around to paying the bill are you able to face someone and ask them to pay for part of what they…

Out of curiosity, what made you put AirBnB in that list?

How they fob you off when things go wrong (secret camera in the room, outright scam with no actual place to stay, etc) until the media gets wind of it at which point they make it right and issue a BS apology?

The latter part is the worst. It's one thing to be a dick but at least if you are then own up to it and be a dick to everyone equally. But this is literally the worst, as it explicitly aims to exploit the most vulnerable (who may not have a huge social media presence or a contact within the press) while attempting to keep a good public image (given the company is still around I guess that's working).

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#384

Post by Nextgrid »

reaperducer wrote: post #367
Drakar1903 wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could book an Uber to two streets away and tell the driver that you actually want to go to somewhere else, and you'll pay the guy under the table. Bet they won't mind that.

Illegal. At least where and when I drove for Uber. And there were plenty of local government inspectors posing as passengers trying to catch these sorts of shenanigans.

Is there any reason why the law would be involved? Uber might not be happy but why does that have legal implications? Does this also mean they're not allowed to drive for anything else but Uber?

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#385

Post by throwaway55554 »

asah wrote: post #361
sschueller wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We can, stop using and supporting these predatory companies. Never use Uber, Lyft, Doordash, Uber Eats, AirBnB etc. No exception irregardless how easy or cheap it may be. It's a small sacrifice but can and will make a difference. Using these services to me is like asking a waiter to pay for part of my meal. When it comes around to paying the bill are you able to face someone and ask them to pay for part of what they…

We can, but.. - incumbent taxis are also predatory services that abuse drivers, arguably worse than Uber/Lyft - and they're a shitty rider experience in many many ways. - hotels are OK but rarely provide kitchens, let alone friendly hosts who bake you killer banana bread (yesterday's stay) - delivery from individual restaurants is rarely available at all, and thus you're going to call a Postmates/etc to help pickup.…

One has to decide, do I give up some comforts to make things better for others or not?

I'm sure it's usually pretty easy to convince oneself that others won't give up the comforts so nothing will change and just continue using the services.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#386

Post by throwaway55554 »

mschuetz wrote: post #239
sschueller wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We can, stop using and supporting these predatory companies. Never use Uber, Lyft, Doordash, Uber Eats, AirBnB etc. No exception irregardless how easy or cheap it may be. It's a small sacrifice but can and will make a difference. Using these services to me is like asking a waiter to pay for part of my meal. When it comes around to paying the bill are you able to face someone and ask them to pay for part of what they…

That's not going to happen, the majority will always be drawn towards the cheaper choices. Work conditions and minimum pay are things that need to be regulated, because people won't chose their burger place based on how much their staff earns.

Increasingly, it is getting harder for most people to not focus on the cheaper choices.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#387

Post by ericmay »

Balvarez wrote: post #372
ericmay wrote: post #339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even with unions this probably wouldn’t happen in America. People just don’t organize, strike, or care about their civic duties or expressing their opinion. I don’t know what happened to us. Maybe we’re all just lazy now?

I suspect that US laws have made unions mostly toothless. I know this has happened to teachers unions. It's illegal for teachers unions in TN to strike(I don't know about other states). What power does a union have if they can't strike? Also Unions have been demonized in the US media and now public perception of unions is extremely low. Which is sad because they're one of the few tools workers have to bargain for the…

Well, it's only public service unions that can't strike (it depends on state/federal/etc. so there are a lot of things here that I can't accurately comment on) and even so I'm not sure that I find myself agreeing with collective bargaining for public employees either. It's a topic for discussion, for sure.

But the point I wanted to make was that I think even if we had stronger unions, Americans like myself have become lazy and afraid of being inconvenienced. We had Occupy Wall-Street, but I'm just not sure. I just don't envision my fellow Americans striking, together, for things. We're barely united on anything as it is right now.

Just some general thoughts/comments. I'd love to hear other perspectives on this.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#388

Post by CaptainZapp »

Aozi wrote: post #327
eru wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germany didn't even have a minimum wage until fairly recently. The Scandinavian countries don't have a minimum wage either, see eg https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/12/nordic-countri... Neither does Switzerland. What's with the American obsession with outlawing poor people's jobs? (My adopted home country, one of the richest places in the world and one of the best places to live, doesn't have a minimum wage…

You're right that those countries don't have a government mandated minimum wage. That doesn't mean there is no minimum wage in practice though. Scandinavian countries have massive powerful trade unions that work to negotiate standards and wages for everyone. Even if you're not actively part of a union, your employer will almost certainly use Collective Labor Agreement negotiated by the trade union. This CLA guarantee…

Now you could not use a CLA drafted by a union and instead try to fuck people over with your own contracts.

That would be illegal in Switzerland (not really a business hating commie hell hole). When a collective agreement exists for specific areas it applies to all companies in that area.

That's not to say that dodgy firms don't try to get around it, but if they're caught it it gets expensive and troublesome. And checks (alas, I don't know if sufficiently) are conducted.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#389

Post by scarface74 »

boh wrote: post #341

It's becoming abundantly clear the real innovation from on-demand services (including ride-sharing companies), is their ability to transfer more money from labor to capital with complex pay structures. For many if not most of these companies, its their only means towards profitability. For instance, any rise in revenue Uber experienced in the last 3 years was exclusively due to cuts in pay for drivers. Tech has long…

How could cutting drivers pay without cutting prices to increase demand raise revenue? It would raise profit possibly or in Uber’s case reduce losses.
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