Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't think the system will fix itself by banning tips. That doesn't help anyone. What society should do is require a decent base pay (regardless of tip). That way I know that my server can make ends meet if I tip them or not, and tipping them becomes a curtesy, not a necessity.
I think a lot of people making comments like this don't realize that the market price of waitstaff's labor is probably similar to fast food or other retail work--$10/hour, maybe a bit more. With tipping, waitstaff can make really good money, to the point that any efforts on the part of a restaurant owner to replace tipping with higher wages tends to result in the entire staff quitting. My point: If "society" "require…
What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips
321–330 of 572 posts
Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips
#322Earlier quoted context omitted.
I guess I should have been a bit more clear. When customers tip, and total wages in the tipped jobs are thus higher than in the non-tipped alternatives, workers will change jobs until expected total wages are about equal. What works in other countries, eg Japan or Australia, is that different social norms lead to much less total tipping. But you can't transform eg American into Japan or Australia at a whim. It's up t…
It's not up to customers if the laws in the US are changed to stop the (IMHO abusive) practice of paying below minimum and then expecting tips to make up the shortfall.
Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips
#323Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can't they still differentiate on the food? What they put on their menu, how it tastes, etc?
How can you compete on quality when every delivery has been sitting in a box for ~10 minutes prior to pickup and ~15 minutes awaiting delivery? Pizza delivery companies like Dominoes spend $$$$$$$ to develop ingredients and methods that ensure that 25 minutes cold pizza is still palatable. That local hibachi or taco joint can't do the same. A cold, premium taco is just as unpalatable as the janky one from the cheap p…
Concerning your point, isn't local delivery dishes still kind off diffirentiated becouse it's local and you test most restaurangs in your area sooner or later?
Edit: I never do home delivery so I don't know how important fresh dishes are.
Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips
#324> “These orders don’t pay for our expenses or our time. We actually lose money when we take those orders. If I pick up an order that is 10 miles away and deliver it 6 miles I’m traveling 16 miles for a $3 order — so I have lost money. I’m in the negative when I account for gas, wear and tear, and other expenses. Not to mention my time.” This begs an obvious question: why are people choosing to do this if it pays $0/h…
People don't realize it is a net negative and just think about the $3 they'll be getting
Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips
#325Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips
#326I drove for DoorDash for about a month. What killed me was the wait between deliveries. I think it was like 45 minutes on average and when I did get a delivery it was like a tiny $7 delivery. There would be 2 hour stretches of times pretty often. But then once in awhile I'd get a string of maybe 3 or 4 runs that paid like $12. over 2 or 3 hours.It was too inconsistent. Had no idea if I ever got tips, from my understa…
When I used Doordash I always saw they sent the delivery driver to the restaurant immediately. The driver would arrive 2 min after the order was placed. Didn't matter if it was at a nice restaurant that takes a long time to cook orders, they'd send the driver immediately and make them wait. Other services don't seem to have that problem. I'm not saying that's why wages and prices suck - because it's pretty much the s…
Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips
#327Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is there any other country other than the US where paying service workers below minimum wage is legal or acceptable? I've been around a fair bit of Europe and surroundings and I've never encountered the US system.
Germany didn't even have a minimum wage until fairly recently. The Scandinavian countries don't have a minimum wage either, see eg https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/12/nordic-countri... Neither does Switzerland. What's with the American obsession with outlawing poor people's jobs? (My adopted home country, one of the richest places in the world and one of the best places to live, doesn't have a minimum wage…
Scandinavian countries have massive powerful trade unions that work to negotiate standards and wages for everyone. Even if you're not actively part of a union, your employer will almost certainly use Collective Labor Agreement negotiated by the trade union. This CLA guarantees certain things like vacation time, minimum wages, break times, etc.
Now you could not use a CLA drafted by a union and instead try to fuck people over with your own contracts. That's not very likely to work though since these countries tend to have strong social welfare systems coupled with free healthcare. So if people quite due to shitty pay and/or hours, they can still make do with social benefits. Also people here in Finland at least, know that for most jobs you absolutely want a CLA drafted by one of the unions because that CLA protects you.
Most companies use the CLA's as a base and allow employees to negotiate better contracts if they want to. E.g you can ask for less hours and more pay, the CLA generally only guarantees minimums. Now an employer can always try to renegotiate the agreement with the union for their workers, but you better be damn sure you treat your workers right since if the unions decide that you're not, they will fuck you up.
These unions are massive and hold a ton of power. In Finland over 70% belong to a union and it is not uncommon for them to strike if the employers are trying to fuck them up. The best example of this is the recent chaos with the Finnish Postal Service.
To give you an idea on what happened, the postal service tried to renegotiate the CLA they used, which would have resulted in worse pay and hours for the workers. Union was taking none of it and went to strike. The postal service tried to get around this using questionable means which broke International Labour Organizations rules. This led to a ton of sympathy strikes which eventually ground the nation to a standstill.
Public transportation froze, flights were cancelled, trains didn't run, all goods transported by postal cars were boycotted by unions this led to stores not being stocked up as they should have for example, ferries and cruise ships under Finnish flag froze. Among numerous other things. The unions eventually won after inconveniencing thousands of people and costing corporations tens of millions of euros.
The workers didn't get shafted and their rights were protected even without a government mandated minimum wage.
Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips
#328I drove for DoorDash for about a month. What killed me was the wait between deliveries. I think it was like 45 minutes on average and when I did get a delivery it was like a tiny $7 delivery. There would be 2 hour stretches of times pretty often. But then once in awhile I'd get a string of maybe 3 or 4 runs that paid like $12. over 2 or 3 hours.It was too inconsistent. Had no idea if I ever got tips, from my understa…
>There's just too many drivers I think. interesting, I'm desperate for more drivers. I run a side business that delivers cookies, drivers do just under 30 deliveries a day (about 3-4 every hour) and make minimum wage plus 100% of tips are split at the end of pay period. it ends up being about $3/delivery in tips, which is an extra $9/hr for a total of $21/hr (minimum wage is $12). A driver could theoretically make ov…
* Drivers want consistent volume; a single popular vendor can provide that. * Drivers prefer ultra efficient transport with what they have. A car in a low-density city like Fresno can work well. But a car in a city like SF is a hassle. * Pay needs to be transparent.
Doordash / Uber eats appear to be finding that “ride”-share for food order delivery can’t make ends meet with the above. Having more traditional dedicated delivery is probably just a better business. Probably why TK decided to do cloud kitchens.
Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips
#329I think legislation is needed for 100% of "gig economy" platforms to in real-time state to the customer exactly how much the service provider is getting paid: how much if my Lyft driver getting - and what cut is Lyft taking, etc.
> in real-time state to the customer exactly how much the service provider is getting paid: how much if my Lyft driver getting - and what cut is Lyft taking, etc. What’s the benefit of real-time reporting? Just require disclosure on the receipt.
Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips
#330Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is there any other country other than the US where paying service workers below minimum wage is legal or acceptable? I've been around a fair bit of Europe and surroundings and I've never encountered the US system.
Germany didn't even have a minimum wage until fairly recently. The Scandinavian countries don't have a minimum wage either, see eg https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/12/nordic-countri... Neither does Switzerland. What's with the American obsession with outlawing poor people's jobs? (My adopted home country, one of the richest places in the world and one of the best places to live, doesn't have a minimum wage…
That didn't mean that people were working several jobs to get by, not that they were paying to work. Maybe it was the easily accessible public welfare that forced employers to pay a living wage, or the large proportion of union membership.