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Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

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Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#81

Post by claudeganon »

nwienert wrote: post #16
virtuous_signal wrote: post #10

This smells like a lot of post-hoc rationalization. Collectivism? What about China, which did terribly on this kind of test. Shintoism? Only 3-4% of the population follows that. See https://www.latimes.com/science/la-sci-people-are-honest-los... where the graphic in the middle of the page compares countries. It appears that Scandinavian countries fare best followed by Eastern European. I would be happy to hear what p…

Homogenous, nationalistic, small country with high IQ, good education system, high GDP, low levels of immigration, and a culture that emphasizes community. Oh, and lower levels of inequality, relatively, and a more aligned politics/media system that doesn’t foment distrust.

> a more aligned politics/media system that doesn’t foment distrust.

Japan is essentially a right-wing, one-party “democracy” put in place by US intelligence services, postwar. The current prime minister is literally the grandson of a CIA-backed war criminal, who was famously known as the “Devil of the Showa Period”:

https://www.nytimes.com/1994/10/09/world/cia-spent-millions-...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobusuke_Kishi

Freedom of the press is absolutely abysmal in Japan and has been further on the downslide since Abe came to power:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jun/13/japan-accused-...

I speak Japanese, have spent a lot of time in the country, and have a great admiration for its people, but about the last thing I’d express any admiration for are its politics and media. And speaking anecdotally, very few people there seem to put much trust in them either.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#82

Post by 1996 »

raarts wrote: post #54
drdeadringer wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "The nail that sticks out gets knocked down." Ever since I first heard this I've kept both this phrase and the phrase "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" in mind at the same time. Basically, both sides of this coin together ask you "should you speak up?" type of thing; substitute "speak up" with whatever the given situation is.

We Dutch have a similar proverb: "Whoever sticks his head above ground level, his head is cut off. "

Tall poppy syndrome, which can be oppressive in Northern Europe.

Germany seems more relaxed than the Netherlands, and France seems to be worse. I've had friends telling me their Mercedes got frequently keyed for no reason, and the old Mercedes star on their classic even got ripped off.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#83

Post by peterwwillis »

jessriedel wrote: post #23
ookblah wrote: post #13

I found this similar mentality in Korea where you can leave your laptop, phone, etc. at a cafe completely exposed on a table while you go to the restroom or even out to lunch. When you come back your stuff will still be there. As I live in NYC, this completely blew my mind and I still felt that anxiety and awkwardness just leaving my stuff to go use the restroom. Near guaranteed theft in NYC lol. --- And to add anoth…

I worked in NYC coffee shops on a daily basis for 2 years (and Toronto and SF for more years). Whenever I went to the bathroom, I just asked a random person nearby if they would make sure no one walked off with my stuff. I never had anything stolen, and the people I ask don't seem bothered in the slightest. It's a very small burden, and I think there's something pleasant about having someone put their trust in you.

If you just want to talk to someone, I get it, but otherwise there's no point. Nobody's going to fight a thief to safeguard a stranger's stuff (and shouldn't because they could be sued by the thief). And it's a crime of opportunity, thiefs are not sitting in cafes waiting for a laptop user to go to the bathroom; high risk, low reward.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#84

Post by jyounker »

jrsdav wrote: post #5

I experienced this while visiting Japan. While doing a transfer on the Shinkansen in Hiroshima, I left my camera bag at a noodle kiosk on the platform (around $3k worth of equipment). Didn't realize it until 2 hours after getting on the next train. When we arrived at our destination, I told my friend we were meeting (a Japanese native) what happened, and she reassured me that it would be right where I left it (said s…

On the other hand, the Japanese are inveterate umbrella thieves. So much so that you will find locking umbrella racks in many buildings.

The pressure has to go somewhere.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#85

Post by Nition »

johnchristopher wrote: post #75
Reedx wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We tend to underestimate the effect culture can have. It's also why the Japanese don't litter their cities, despite few garbage bins. https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2017/07/why-japanese-dont-lit...

Yeah, well. Maybe, maybe not. Quoted from a previous discussion: > I was cycling in Japan for about 2 weeks, just a few weeks ago. I was also impressed in most places by how clean it was, not only in the cities, but more generally speaking about everywhere. > At some point though, I was cycling along the coast of Mie then Wakayama prefectures, and although the scenery and roads were clean, I had a glance just behind…

When I was in Japan in 2009, every pedestrian in the cities waited patiently at each crossing until the light turned green, even if there were no cars around at all.

However, when the streets were mostly empty, I saw one Japanese man come to an empty crossing, glance around, and cross on red.

Can't generalize much off a single example, but it did make me think peer pressure is probably a factor.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#86

Post by tareqak »

jyounker wrote: post #84
jrsdav wrote: post #5

I experienced this while visiting Japan. While doing a transfer on the Shinkansen in Hiroshima, I left my camera bag at a noodle kiosk on the platform (around $3k worth of equipment). Didn't realize it until 2 hours after getting on the next train. When we arrived at our destination, I told my friend we were meeting (a Japanese native) what happened, and she reassured me that it would be right where I left it (said s…

On the other hand, the Japanese are inveterate umbrella thieves. So much so that you will find locking umbrella racks in many buildings. The pressure has to go somewhere.

Why umbrellas specifically? I read the article and I enjoyed it, but the question of why umbrellas are not treated the same in terms of being returned was mentioned but not answered. Near the end of the article, there is this sentence

> “Communal property is virtually unheard of except for that many people seem to regard umbrellas as up for grabs if not properly secured.”

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#87

Post by the_af »

jyounker wrote: post #84
jrsdav wrote: post #5

I experienced this while visiting Japan. While doing a transfer on the Shinkansen in Hiroshima, I left my camera bag at a noodle kiosk on the platform (around $3k worth of equipment). Didn't realize it until 2 hours after getting on the next train. When we arrived at our destination, I told my friend we were meeting (a Japanese native) what happened, and she reassured me that it would be right where I left it (said s…

On the other hand, the Japanese are inveterate umbrella thieves. So much so that you will find locking umbrella racks in many buildings. The pressure has to go somewhere.

Is this for fancy umbrellas or any umbrella? I once lost a cheap plastic umbrella while visiting a castle, which I left for a minute to take a photo and it was gone, and I always assumed another tourist took it by mistake.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#88

Post by Aunche »

supernova87a wrote: post #64
lawn wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wasn't there a story a while ago how a Japanese school essentially forced (or put a lot of pressure) a schoolgirl to dye her hair to fit in with the other girls, but it failed over and over until she got burns on her head?

Another regarding gender expectations is the recent news that a (maybe more than 1?) Japanese medical school's admissions staff were rigging standardized test scores to disfavor women applicants. This is because they were seen as less reliable / career-oriented or productive (or whatever justification) for not favoring them to receive the education that men deserve. Expectations.

It isn't an irrational bias thing. Women in Japan are pressured to stay at home to take care of the kids, so they're less likely to work as much as a men.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#89

Post by kstenerud »

tareqak wrote: post #86
jyounker wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, the Japanese are inveterate umbrella thieves. So much so that you will find locking umbrella racks in many buildings. The pressure has to go somewhere.

Why umbrellas specifically? I read the article and I enjoyed it, but the question of why umbrellas are not treated the same in terms of being returned was mentioned but not answered. Near the end of the article, there is this sentence > “Communal property is virtually unheard of except for that many people seem to regard umbrellas as up for grabs if not properly secured.”

Because when the rain comes down, it COMES DOWN HARD, and you NEED an umbrella NOW. I started doing the same after living there a few years.

Same thing with stealing crappy bikes with flat tires from the nearest bike rack to get home when you're drunk as a skunk at 3 am.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#90

Post by kstenerud »

harikb wrote: post #32
jrsdav wrote: post #5

I experienced this while visiting Japan. While doing a transfer on the Shinkansen in Hiroshima, I left my camera bag at a noodle kiosk on the platform (around $3k worth of equipment). Didn't realize it until 2 hours after getting on the next train. When we arrived at our destination, I told my friend we were meeting (a Japanese native) what happened, and she reassured me that it would be right where I left it (said s…

Is it possible the social support structure, education, etc are creating a society where unfortunate people don't have to steal/pawn to make a living?

No, it's a cultural thing. Home burglaries and thefts from cars and shops are fairly common, but you don't take unattended bags and such that are left in the open.
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