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What kind of data is my new car collecting?

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Re: What kind of data is my new car collecting?

#151

Post by slipheen »

falcolas wrote: post #116
clucas wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not legal advice, and you should consult an attorney if you believe that an OEM may come after you for tampering with your own vehicle. That said, I believe that there is very limited legal recourse for a vehicle OEM who wants to prevent an end user from changing the data collection and upload features of their vehicles. The worst thing would be potentially voiding the warranty, but for 10-15 year old used ve…

Don't forget that Tesla is now in this space, and turning off Tesla's access to it will turn off your car, period. I have a hard time believing that others in the industry will not take the blase reaction to this and then do it themselves.

I've read about people removing the modems from their Teslas in the past.

Have they updated the software such that this isn't possible?

Re: What kind of data is my new car collecting?

#152

Post by bsenftner »

0xffff2 wrote: post #76
bsenftner wrote: post #3

Yeah, my last car purchase was an exercise in locating a vehicle without any "smart" technologies. Car manufacturers are the last corporate group I'd trust with anything they are not heavily regulated to provide, such as basic safety measures such as the seat belts they fought for years not to provide. I plan on this being a car I nurse forever, as it is going to be a generation of extremely intrusive data collection…

What car did you end up buying?

Subaru Forester 2016 model.

Re: What kind of data is my new car collecting?

#153

Post by brewdad »

raesene9 wrote: post #26
tonyedgecombe wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/03/27/cars-in-europe-could-be-fitt... You won't be allowed to break the law. The petrol heads will complain but they will lose because "think of the children".

I predict a strong market for "classic" cars that are exempt from these regulations...

I predict that drivers would then be required to retrofit a monitoring device in order to be road legal. Oregon already experimented with GPS tracking as an alternative to paying the gas tax.

Re: What kind of data is my new car collecting?

#154

Post by jhoechtl »

rrdharan wrote: post #82
jhoechtl wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fond memories of my Merceded W124. You could rip the engine out of the car and it would go on and on. No electricity for motor management required whatsoever.

I think you meant "rip the battery out"?

What I meant was the pure engine without any additional managment once running was able to sustain itself.

It's one of the last types of Mercedes which were meant to go through WWIII and back.

Re: What kind of data is my new car collecting?

#156

Post by magduf »

SamuelAdams wrote: post #4

> “There’s just massive amounts of data being collected, and if you want the service, you have to agree to it. And people do agree to it, and they have relatively little control over things,” Scassa says. I'm curious what this will do to the used car market in 10-15 years. Say the original owner consented to all this data tracking. They go to sell the car to buy a new one, and the 2nd owner does not agree to the trac…

>Furthermore, if a customer changes the car to stop data upload, that could be seen as tampering with a vehicle. This could lead to legal consequences, but I'm not a lawyer so I can't dwell on the specifics.

Where are you getting this crazy idea? If it's your car, you can tamper with it all you want, as long as you don't violate emissions laws and stuff like that. There's no law preventing you from tampering with your car's data collection or transmission, or most other things for that matter. How do you think the entire aftermarket parts industry exists?

Re: What kind of data is my new car collecting?

#157

Post by magduf »

clucas wrote: post #99
SamuelAdams wrote: post #4

> “There’s just massive amounts of data being collected, and if you want the service, you have to agree to it. And people do agree to it, and they have relatively little control over things,” Scassa says. I'm curious what this will do to the used car market in 10-15 years. Say the original owner consented to all this data tracking. They go to sell the car to buy a new one, and the 2nd owner does not agree to the trac…

This is not legal advice, and you should consult an attorney if you believe that an OEM may come after you for tampering with your own vehicle. That said, I believe that there is very limited legal recourse for a vehicle OEM who wants to prevent an end user from changing the data collection and upload features of their vehicles. The worst thing would be potentially voiding the warranty, but for 10-15 year old used ve…

>That said, I believe that there is very limited legal recourse for a vehicle OEM who wants to prevent an end user from changing the data collection and upload features of their vehicles. The worst thing would be potentially voiding the warranty, but for 10-15 year old used vehicles, that's not an issue.

>I work as an in-house counsel at a vehicle OEM

If you're really a lawyer, I'm surprised you'd write any of this, because it's blatantly false. The Magnusson-Moss Warranty Act of 1975 makes it blatantly illegal to "void" a warranty for any modification, unless it can be proven that the modification caused the issue that the customer is making a warranty claim for.

Re: What kind of data is my new car collecting?

#158

Post by mothsonasloth »

I used to work for a British car manufacturer which is currently in the process of monetizing all the telemetry they get out of their vehicles, some examples:

* Pothole tracking --> sell to local goverments

* Tyre wear --> sell customer data to target adverts for them / promotions

* Hybrid battery charge levels --> sell data to EV charge point companies.

What was even more concerning was that this data is being collected by another company (who supplied the hardware), who had first dibs on the data.

Re: What kind of data is my new car collecting?

#159

Post by i_am_proteus »

deaps wrote: post #43
overcast wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's how diesel works, off its own compression.

Yeah - I remember when I was a volunteer firefighter - if you parked a fire truck in an atmosphere that was filled with combustible gasses, the engine would not shut off. The trucks were equipped with some type of an emergency throw should that situation ever arise. We never had to use it in my time there.

Discharging a CO2 bottle into the air intake is the usual ticket.

Re: What kind of data is my new car collecting?

#160

Post by matheusmoreira »

Seenso wrote: post #123
falcolas wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget that Tesla is now in this space, and turning off Tesla's access to it will turn off your car, period. I have a hard time believing that others in the industry will not take the blase reaction to this and then do it themselves.

> Don't forget that Tesla is now in this space, and turning off Tesla's access to it will turn off your car, period. Which is super scary. A couple years ago one of their firmware engineers had his NDA expire, and he posted some stories about his time there in some forum. One of the stories that stuck with me is they were really sloppy with their updates. One time the pushed one that wasn't fully cooked (it might hav…

That's horrifying. Reminds me of this:

https://www.wired.com/2016/08/jeep-hackers-return-high-speed...

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