Live data from Hacker News

iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

appleinsider.com

61–70 of 461 posts

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#61
post #8

The alert is annoying although for apps you want to have always on location tracking although, like some life logging apps. (Arc, etc) It's like OS doesn't want to accept there are apps you want always on location tracking on and for it to stop annoying you about it.

They just need a "don't ask me again about this app" option. I'm surprised they don't have that already.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#62
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you choose a weather location manually, you actually get a less fine-grained report than the one you get from a GPS-resolved location. Basically, you get weather for "the closest weather station to the geographic centre of the named city" rather than "the closest weather station to you." This can be a big deal if your city has a large altitude range, such that going a few miles east means the difference between…

Why not use a ZIP/postal code?

In the case where you never go anywhere, how is that different from giving them your precise location? They very likely know enough other things about you to deanonymize a postal code into your actual address.

In the case where you do go places, the difference is that you get a weather report for where you are, rather than where you live. When I'm at my girlfriend's house, and I check the weather report, I want to know what the weather's going to be like tomorrow at my girlfriend's house, not at my house. And when I'm at the office and considering where to go for lunch, I want to know whether it's going to be raining at noon in the area of town around my office.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#63
post #2

And it’s not just location data. I am amazed at how many apps want Bluetooth, too. Umm, there isn’t a single listed feature that indicates a need for BT, why are you asking? Oh, so you can use that as a tracking vector, too. Well, not only do you not get BT, you don’t get to live on my phone anymore, either. As for the advertisers, boo-hoo. You raised a finger (or two, depending on locale) to “do not track”, you thin…

Would the situation be different if Apple's biggest rival wasn't basically an advertising and data mining company? I wouldn't put it below Apple to profit from advertising control if Google didn't have an iron grip on it.

Isn't that good? Now their goals naturally align with ours. That means these ideals will outlast CEOs (at least until one of the CEOs decides Google doesn't matter any more...)

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#64

On the other hand Apple has forced apps to use location data for purposes it should not be used for. Termius, for example, is my favorite iOS SSH app. But according to them, they can’t keep an SSH session running in the background unless they’re constantly tracking your location data. And somehow Apple approved this usage of location data. I don’t want to give Termius my location. I don’t want them tracking me everyw…

Main problem facing any app that needs to run in the background is that Apple only allows it for certain use cases - VoIP, audio/airplay, location and BLE being the main ones. That's why since iOS 13 users have been seeing alerts that apps with no reason to need Bluetooth are requesting it.

So I deny most apps use of this, as it's clearly just a ploy to keep their app running when it shouldn't be. Something like the Termius app you cite has a legitimate reason to run in the background though and has to ask for one of those permissions.

It's a weird grey area IMO. I'm sure if you asked the Termius developers they may tell you that they don't even use the location data and that it's just a mechanism to keep the app running. However, the fact that we as users don't know this for sure is a problem that Apple could fix by adding a specific background permission alert.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We also had to do this to get enough background time. I can honestly say we don't track you. customers also get mad when the app intermittent stops doing its job. I just hope the app review team doesn't throw us out again.

I just don’t understand why Apple doesn’t have a “allow to run in background” permission. Instead developers have to resort to Bluetooth or silent audio or location tracking which further erodes user trust and allows for developers to say “I swear we don’t track you” while actually tracking you.

Because developers would abuse it. Look at what Huawei does to force kill apps just to “fix” this

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#66

Over the years I've considered switching to Android a few times but Apple's really locking in as my preferred device from their privacy work. Not sure this moves the needle with consumers but it does for me.

I get the same location-data popup on Android.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#67

On the other hand Apple has forced apps to use location data for purposes it should not be used for. Termius, for example, is my favorite iOS SSH app. But according to them, they can’t keep an SSH session running in the background unless they’re constantly tracking your location data. And somehow Apple approved this usage of location data. I don’t want to give Termius my location. I don’t want them tracking me everyw…

Anyone know of a good open source alternative to the Termius input on iOS?

I loved Termius but didnt realize that keys were uploaded to their servers until I opened it on my laptop and saw it download all my keys.

Spent the day rotating all my keys.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#68
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the real fix here is to move off ssh onto a mosh server, as it's specifically designed to fix this use-case without requiring a persistent connection https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mosh_(software)

The problem as I understand it isn’t the ssh connection being dropped but the app being closed and needing to reload. Because iOS devices don’t have enough RAM to keep an app in the background while also running Safari.

Humorous, but the curse of Android devices is that every single app demands a perpetual background service doing close to nothing. Of course we see the same thing on Windows and macOS where everyone thinks they need their own background daemons for the most absurdly simple task.

I definitely prefer the iOS model.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem as I understand it isn’t the ssh connection being dropped but the app being closed and needing to reload. Because iOS devices don’t have enough RAM to keep an app in the background while also running Safari.

Humorous, but the curse of Android devices is that every single app demands a perpetual background service doing close to nothing. Of course we see the same thing on Windows and macOS where everyone thinks they need their own background daemons for the most absurdly simple task. I definitely prefer the iOS model.

I don’t see why it can’t be requested like any other permission. Otherwise apps just abuse location and audio to make it work anyway. It’s not like apps AREN’T working in the background.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#70
post #60

On the other hand Apple has forced apps to use location data for purposes it should not be used for. Termius, for example, is my favorite iOS SSH app. But according to them, they can’t keep an SSH session running in the background unless they’re constantly tracking your location data. And somehow Apple approved this usage of location data. I don’t want to give Termius my location. I don’t want them tracking me everyw…

iOS really needs a channel for legitimate, real background apps. A lot of its battery life and security advantages over Android come from the fact that it doesn't allow a wild-west of background processes, but there are certain cases where you really do just need that. Apple is good at taking use-cases and creating cohesive stories around the right way to serve them; this one has been long-coming.

Agreed. Camera upload to DropBox is one situation I've run into. Currently it seems like it's using some janky set up where each time I change location it triggers an event to look for new photos to upload but this results in Apple notifying me of DropBox looking up my location X amount of times in the last few days.
Post reply on HN