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Low unemployment isn’t worth much if the jobs barely pay

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Re: Low unemployment isn’t worth much if the jobs barely pay

#231

Post by ar0 »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #168
behringer wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't get treatment for life-threatening "conditions". You can only get treatment for life-threatening "emergencies". You got a tumor? Good fucking luck. You got a seizure because of your tumor? Come on in and we'll make sure to send you an absurd bill later.

I know multiple poor people that had their cancers cured without cost to themselves, no "emergency" required. The reality isn't as bleak as you are making it. The US has the highest cancer survival rate in the world, which would not be possible if poorer populations were not having their cancers proactively treated.

> The US has the highest cancer survival rate in the world

The US isn’t bad in that respect, but according to Wikipedia, this statement isn’t even true for the subset of countries on their list: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_quality...

Re: Low unemployment isn’t worth much if the jobs barely pay

#232

Post by toomuchtodo »

alpineidyll3 wrote: post #195
_0uto wrote: post #31

I see a lot of protestant mentality here in comments valuing any kind of even inhumane labour which does not allow to meet basic needs over not having a job, but also not suffering from hunger thanks to the social support system. In my opinion, we as a society should aim to work less and less, collectively making use of automation and technological progress. But it will be hard when we label this as being lazy and no…

Conservative perspectives often involve some sort of built-in need to proselytize, because they view life as a triumph of ego over intrinsic human weakness. There's an idea that all people need to hear the message of personal responsibility. Sadly data is weaker than any bias of perspectives, and people find it impossible to think causally without some larger brittle philosophical framework.

Most unfortunately you can change the minds of some, but others you have to wait for them to die. Progress occurs one funeral at a time.

Re: Low unemployment isn’t worth much if the jobs barely pay

#233

Post by _jal »

CivBase wrote: post #71
HenryKissinger wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Health care is not tied to employment in Canada, for one.

Heath insurance is a benefit offered by some US employers as an alternative form of compensation. Employers get discounted rates because of how many customers they bring to the insurer and they pocket some of those savings while passing the rest on to the employees. You can get health insurance without having a job. It's expensive, but it's not like it's cheap through employers. Just cheap er . Health care - at least…

> Employers get discounted rates because of how many customers

That's hilarious.

I mean, you are correct that employers bundle employees together. But without massive government intervention during and after WWII, the industry would have been wildly different, and the way the trend began was highly historically contingent:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stabilization_Act_of_1942

Econ 101 is insufficient for understanding the world.

Re: Low unemployment isn’t worth much if the jobs barely pay

#234

Post by bsanr2 »

gist wrote: post #67
HeWhoLurksLate wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was younger, I worked a job at a car wash. There was only one thing I really did all day long- vacuum cars and wipe them down. This got repetitive quickly, and the managers got really upset whenever you slacked off in the lulls. Groups of more than three people chatting while we had "downtime" were more or less immediately disbanded. Checking your phone, even to text your family, was a big no-no on company tim…

> (I lasted about two months before I found a better job) because the job was so menial- and the managers so demeaning- that all joy in working was lost fairly regularly. That sounds like a good outcome though. If the job weren't so bad you might have stuck with it. You could say that you (and others 'talented') were lucky it sucked so much.

But the job still needed to get done. Just in terms of basic human decency, maybe we shouldn't encourage abuse and exploitation of workers just because "they can just get a better job."

Re: Low unemployment isn’t worth much if the jobs barely pay

#235

Post by robotresearcher »

freeone3000 wrote: post #158
seanmccann wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I understand — without private insurance in Canada, somebody with few resources in Canada is at risk of financial ruin from any of the health conditions you mentioned. For older Canadians, a pre-existing condition may not be covered, which means a serious condition could rack up significant medical bills. Edit: I should have specifically said that I'm talking about expensive prescription drugs and required…

This is not true. This is nearly a lie. Private insurance in Canada barely exists, and primarily covers prescription coverage and paramedial (acupuncture, chiropracty, TCM, etc.) Inpatient prescriptions are covered by provincial health. Doctor's visits are covered by provincial health. Dental may or may not be covered. Hospital stays, urgent care, ER visits, routine checkups, mental health are covered by provincial h…

> Private insurance in Canada barely exists

Private insurance for prescriptions, dental, vision, etc. is offered by most big employers in Canada.

"As CBC News points out, private health insurance is “a crucial part of the system,” and Canadians spent about $43.2 billion on private coverage in 2005."

https://thinkprogress.org/can-canadians-purchase-private-hea...

Re: Low unemployment isn’t worth much if the jobs barely pay

#236

Post by TheCoelacanth »

supernova87a wrote: post #36

I don't think low unemployment is the unequivocal positive sign that politicians/ think it is ("We're putting millions of Americans back to work!"). Maybe it's not something to be so proud of. If people are having to come out of the woodwork to take jobs that aren't moving the average wage up, maybe they're doing it because they have to, in order to get by. Is it a good thing that a 60+ year old goes back to work at…

Unemployment only counts people who are looking for work, but don't have it, so I don't think that framing is accurate.

Someone who is not working by choice is not unemployed.

Re: Low unemployment isn’t worth much if the jobs barely pay

#238

Post by jkoudys »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #153
dfilppi wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You dont need a job to have access to health care in the US. All you need is the ability to pay for the services you use.

For most people, no job means both no medical insurance and also no ability to pay out of pocket. So I'm baffled as to how this is supposed to be a rebuttal.

It's doubly confusing, as you'll find unhealthy people have a much harder time earning the money in order to get well so they can work.

Re: Low unemployment isn’t worth much if the jobs barely pay

#239

Post by orangecat »

supernova87a wrote: post #36

I don't think low unemployment is the unequivocal positive sign that politicians/ think it is ("We're putting millions of Americans back to work!"). Maybe it's not something to be so proud of. If people are having to come out of the woodwork to take jobs that aren't moving the average wage up, maybe they're doing it because they have to, in order to get by. Is it a good thing that a 60+ year old goes back to work at…

Is it a good thing that a 60+ year old goes back to work at a low paying job because he/she can't pay the bills?

A 60 year old who is voluntarily retired is not "unemployed". If they later end up taking a job due to financial hardship, that changes the unemployment rate very little; it just adds 1 to the denominator of people in the labor force.

Re: Low unemployment isn’t worth much if the jobs barely pay

#240

Post by [deleted] »

rexreed wrote: post #47

I would like to advance a different opinion. There are many that are proponents of Universal Basic Income (UBI). However, many state that one problem with UBI is that it comes at the expense of personal gratification and economic productivity. I am of the opinion that low wage jobs are a form of UBI. In this manner, individuals are paid a basic income in exchange for their productivity. However, these jobs are not me…

[deleted]
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