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Women now make up the majority of the U.S. labor force

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Re: Women now make up the majority of the U.S. labor force

#181
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with Esther Perel's thinking[1] that the next century is going to involve a broadening on what society deems a positive life is for straight, cis men. In the same way that we consider it acceptable for women to express themselves or live differently than the gender roles of the past, I think we'll start to do the same for men. I already see this with my millennial or genZ peers. It's not uncommon to read comm…

> It's not uncommon to read comments on Hacker News or twitter from men feeling that they seen as less valid for doing less traditional activities[2][3] (eg: caring for children, prioritizing their careers less, being less traditionally forward, etc.) and I think society is going to need to change to acknowledge this better for both men and women. That is an interesting angle. What do you think is going to change, an…

I think it's obvious this is already changing rapidly. Maybe certain antiquated standards of masculinity still reign supreme in rural Indiana (or wherever), but in major metros there is an constantly expanding spectrum within which gender can be expressed without drawing criticism.

It may be unusual for a man to stay home and take care of the children while his wife works. But the idea that I could ever stigmatize or criticism someone for this life arrangement is ridiculous to me. I'm sure that 40 years ago most men would only be able to respond with criticism. But these days that kind of reaction is laughable. And the men who have that kind of reaction would be viewed as backwards simpletons.

Re: Women now make up the majority of the U.S. labor force

#182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a non-American, what's up with this basement meme? Do American homes have furnished rooms in the literal basement or is it just a joke? Or are they like half basements with small windows?

Yeah, in the US, if you have a basement, it's most often finished or at least partially finished, with walls and insulation and so on. Teenagers often like to hang out there because it offers semi-private living. See TV shows like "That 70s Show" for a prime example.

Wow, here the basements usually only have stuff like washing machines, heating equipment and storage for all sorts of clutter and tools.

I cannot imagine living in a windowless room, feels like a dungeon or torture room.

Re: Women now make up the majority of the U.S. labor force

#183
post #80

The labor force participation rates for men and women are currently at 69.2% and 57.7% respectively. They arbitrarily exclude farming positions but cite mining, logging, manufacturing, transportation, and warehouse roles traditionally occupied by men. This article doesn't really seem to paint a full or accurate picture.

FWIW I see "non-farm employment" rather often when anything related to unemployment happens. From what I gather, it's how all the data has been categorized forever.

So while I can't give you the reasoning behind it, and don't know if it's still valid or now just being done to make the data comparable, I can assure you choosing this statistic wasn't a bad-faith attempt to manipulate.

Re: Women now make up the majority of the U.S. labor force

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't say couples. I said married people. Married people BY LAW do not have separate finances. Your situation is completely different.

In the case of a married couple, it's my understanding that if you refuse to share your earnings with a spouse, the spouse has to either put up with it or divorce you and ask the court to give them a share of it. Absent the nuclear option of a divorce, finances can be kept separate.

https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/separate-community-p...

Common Law States

Most states, except those listed as community property states below, use the "common law" system of property ownership. In these states, it's usually easy to tell which spouse owns what. If only your name is on the deed, registration document, or other title paper, it's yours. If you and your spouse both have your name on the title, you each own a half interest in the property unless the title document says otherwise. If an item doesn't have a title document, generally you own it if you paid for it or received it as a gift.

Community Property States

If you live in a community property state, the rules are more complicated. But in general:

spouses own equally almost all property either one acquires during the marriage, regardless of whose name the property is in

half of each spouse's income is owned by the other spouse during the marriage, and

debts incurred during marriage are generally debts of the couple.

In community property states, the following is separate property:

gifts given to one spouse

property either spouse owned before the marriage and kept separate during the marriage, and

inheritances.

The community property states are: Alaska (by agreement), Arizona, California, Idaho, Louisiana, Nevada, New Mexico, Texas, Washington, and Wisconsin. (In Alaska, spouses can sign an agreement making specific assets community property.)

Re: Women now make up the majority of the U.S. labor force

#185
post #67
post #58

Interesting. Will there be a nationwide push to hire more men to make up for all of this inequality?

Not sure what inequality you're talking about, given that the US population is right at a 50/50 split between men and women. Then again, I'm not sure how genuine you're being here.

In the US, there are 97 men per 100 women.

Re: Women now make up the majority of the U.S. labor force

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of couples keep separate finances. Money is one of the biggest reasons couples split up, after all. While my boyfriend and I aren’t married, we do split our household contributions and pay from our own accounts. I think it is also interesting to study the money men and women bring separately into their relationship and how that plays into relationship dynamics.

I didn't say couples. I said married people. Married people BY LAW do not have separate finances. Your situation is completely different.

> Married people BY LAW do not have separate finances.

That's... not true at all.

The IRS tax forms even have an entire category for people who are married but maintain separate finances. It's called "married filing separate".

Now in some states there are laws that property acquired after marriage is shared, you can still maintain separate finances, and then it is up to a judge to figure it out in the case of divorce.

Also, you keep what you entered the marriage with. If you maintain separate finances, it's a lot easier to disentangle if you get divorced.

I have a friend who is on his second marriage, and his wife is also on her second. They maintain separate finances because they were both burned on a divorce, and they are very aware of what is common property and what is not. They could split up pretty much any time without a lawyer because they keep such good books.

Re: Women now make up the majority of the U.S. labor force

#187
So much for diversity and inclusivity. In colleges and universities we are all taught to site our sources but if you are Bloomberg you can just make up data points to push a political agenda. It would be nice if there was a data source to reference to understand how they arrived at their stats. But hey we're just supposed to believe in pretty graphs with no source as being truthful and representative or the facts. Not to mention treading at Hacker News so it must be true.

It's also important to remember that: "76% of all statics are made up including this one!"

Here's something else to ponder!! Where were all of the women over the last 10 years when we were building out all of this tech? We needed women software engineers!! I saw very low numbers in my 13+ years in the bay area. The only women in software engineering roles were here on VISA. Now that we have leadership roles and political narratives.... we all of the sudden have a huge turnout. But hey what do I know. 13 years in the bay area working at top tech companies. No credibility at all. Argue with me and tell me know I am clearly wrong!

Re: Women now make up the majority of the U.S. labor force

#188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> What are men doing if not working? On disability? Homeless? Retiring earlier? Some are living in their parents basement until they're 30 to 40. It has been hypothesized that with the breakdown of families in the US, men are giving up, and that includes efforts to build a stable foundation for their family. See MGTOW but dont read too much, it can be kind of depressing.

> Some are living in their parents basement until they're 30 to 40. I understand this is considered a bad thing, and it makes sense at a societal level, but honestly it sounds like a pretty amazing life. Maybe that would have been boring and depressing pre-internet, but it seems pretty good now. I know one dude who essentially grifted his way into the disability system, and I've watched him go from an anxious mess to…

>Maybe we need an acceptable way for people who can't mentally handle work to be able to exist in society.

I initially felt on-the-fence about this but upon further thought I absolutely disagree with the idea.

Society works and thrives when we've a common goal (all working to make things slightly better for everyone one bit at a time) and honest reciprocal agreements as one.

I am happy to partake in a society where the majority are trying their best for themselves and others, to support them when they fall down and want to get back up, or to step out of the workforce to procreate or retrain, to provide healthcare for all, access to housing, education etc.

I don't mind paying a little more if everyone who's willing to try their best to lean in to society and contribute gets the support and opportunity to do so, even if there's a disproportionate difference in outcome i.e. if all you're capable of doing is flipping burgers, parking cars, collecting trash, etc. then that's fine, just do your best at it.

I absolutely will not support those who just want to opt-out, unless safeguards were put in place to ensure their malignant genes stopped with them at the end of their days. I would also absolutely not support extending the right to vote to such people.

You get out what you put in. It's ok to try and fail, or fall ill, or struggle with a mental illness. It's good for a society to be there to help you pick yourself back up, to become well, and try again. It's the intent that counts. If you (the rhetorical you) merely want to sit on the sidelines because "life's too tough" then I'm sorry but you won't be doing it on my dime, or trying to sway the direction of my society with voter rights.

Re: Women now make up the majority of the U.S. labor force

#189
post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Depressed, committing suicide or just doing nothing. But apparently nobody cares. We've had a decade+ of men being told they're useless oppressors, who've earned nothing for themselves, whose "time is up", and that they haven't a place in the future. Couple that with the loss of shared identity in general, the breakdown of the family, the bias in the divorce process, the disappearance of purposeful work and more an…

>the bias in the divorce process That one you can probably place the blame squarely on the conservatives for. That bias made some sense back in the old days when women couldn't possibly hope to get a job that paid anywhere near what her (now ex-)husband earned. But things are completely different now, but the court system is still stuck in the 1950s. Meanwhile, the men who complain about this bias continue to vote fo…

> but the court system is still stuck in the 1950s

Somehow, I don't think that there are many conservative judges in family courts. Family court judges heavily lean female and liberal.

Re: Women now make up the majority of the U.S. labor force

#190
post #80

The labor force participation rates for men and women are currently at 69.2% and 57.7% respectively. They arbitrarily exclude farming positions but cite mining, logging, manufacturing, transportation, and warehouse roles traditionally occupied by men. This article doesn't really seem to paint a full or accurate picture.

FWIW I see "non-farm employment" rather often when anything related to unemployment happens. From what I gather, it's how all the data has been categorized forever. So while I can't give you the reasoning behind it, and don't know if it's still valid or now just being done to make the data comparable, I can assure you choosing this statistic wasn't a bad-faith attempt to manipulate.

Farm employment has always been more informal, harder to track, and rife with illegal practices (child labor, illegal immigrants, minimum wage violations) that make reported data hard to trust/reason from.
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