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Worst Ed-Tech Debacles of the Decade

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Re: Worst Ed-Tech Debacles of the Decade

#41
post #35

I spent years working in ed-tech, at more than one company on this list, and know people at many others. There were two overarching lessons I took from my experience. The first is that a successful educational product needs to deeply and intimately understand pedagogy and materials -- teaching and learning techniques and how they vary between students, and what kinds of materials are suitable -- deeply , I mean like…

> You have to hire educational+domain experts. ... who are willing to attack their own profession.

Seems plausible enough to me.

The academic job market is absolutely brutal. Ever more administrators are being hired, and (in some disciplines anyway) fewer and fewer tenure-track professors.

As a result, there are tons of experts, with traditional academic training in spades, who are eager to work in their domain of expertise, and who might be well inclined to engage in some "disruption".

Re: Worst Ed-Tech Debacles of the Decade

#42

While I understand I only met a small fraction of the people trying to "disrupt" education, my experience with Ed-Tech was that the absolute wrong people were behind it. I interviewed at Coursera in 2012, and much of the interview focused on my academic background. Every round I'd sit down with an interviewer and they'd look at my transcript and say, "hmm what happened here!?" as they would point to my C+, the only g…

A C+ is a reasonable thing to ask about.

I disagree, unless you are hiring straight out of college and the C+ is in an immediately relevant or "red flag" class. I can't imagine being asked this. I studied philosophy, I'm interviewing to write software, who cares about my grades?

Re: Worst Ed-Tech Debacles of the Decade

#43
post #19

What’s worked in Ed-tech—ever? Bank street writer. It kept nascent computer classes from killing typing and made grading so much easier , saving the writing careers of many with poor handwriting. Logo: tens of millions of people have a lever to learn functional abstraction from “repeat 360 [fd 1 rt 1]” Project Athena. Frankly, I still want that ability to log in anywhere and have my setup ready to go. Project Andrew,…

I'd say Lynda.com was hugely successful. Or is that not considered Ed-Tech?

I should take another look!

I learn more by reading, and the ubiquitous PDF of course notes findable by DDGo is really something. Ubiquitous preprinted are amazing.

But YouTube’s videos have helped me fix home appliances, fuse PVC, and pick up all sorts of practical skills. Lynda could be in the same avenue for work skills.

Re: Worst Ed-Tech Debacles of the Decade

#44
> 85. The Teacher Influencer Hustle

This. I've been pitched by teacher-influencers and librarian-influencers who want to do sponsored posts about my edtech startup. Such posts are generally not marked as sponsored, and I have always declined their offers.

I understand teachers need to make ends meet (my wife, mother, and grandmother work/worked in education), but that doesn't justify this sort of business practice. It's unethical and also pretty clearly illegal per FTC regulations.

Re: Worst Ed-Tech Debacles of the Decade

#45
As a university professor, I'm struck at how few of these I've heard of -- and, of those which I've heard of, how little I care.

I just don't feel like I have problems which I'm itching to have solved by technology.

As an example of this, I've graded thousands of calculus exams in my career. It's time consuming, it's painful, and it's unpleasant. But it's also inevitable. Looking at my students' work, engaging with their mistakes, seeing what they do and don't understand -- helps to build the connection between myself and my students, helps me understand what is going on in my classroom.

You can't automate that away.

Re: Worst Ed-Tech Debacles of the Decade

#46
post #33
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "hmm what happened here!?" as they would point to my C+ Man that would be an instant turn off for me. Having said that I'm unlikely to end up in a room with folks who would say something like that anyway, mostly because I wouldn't make it past the resume filter... for good reason, and a good outcome for everyone involved probabbly.

Which is weird. Because as GP inpugned, how are a bunch of hyper-conventional learners going to 'disrupt' education? We have a lot of people who haven't been served by the current educational system. Wouldn't you rather hire people who did poorly in school and yet were still very successful in their careers and find out what they know?

Yeah I would seriously wonder how focusing on a staff of excelent ... but traditional learning types could change much.

I was a terrible college student and worked my way through PC support drone, some proprietary mainframe networking stuff, traditional networking, data center networking...to web development.

That and sometimes the folks who really just grok something...are terrible at teaching and advice. I'm really wary when highly successful traditional learners tell me how or even what to learn, not because I think they're wrong, but their path is likely not best for me.

Re: Worst Ed-Tech Debacles of the Decade

#47

I spent years working in ed-tech, at more than one company on this list, and know people at many others. There were two overarching lessons I took from my experience. The first is that a successful educational product needs to deeply and intimately understand pedagogy and materials -- teaching and learning techniques and how they vary between students, and what kinds of materials are suitable -- deeply , I mean like…

Also in edtech. I mostly agree with your points here.

My personal opinion is that for some sort of meaningful disruption to happen, ed tech entrepreneurs will have to craft their tools such that they are focused on the end user being the student and what their ultimate needs are. I would also say that the company/idea would need some way to start attacking credentialism and challenge the status quo (university degrees) which also mean you have to factor in the needs of employers.

The truth is most people won't bother with learning much of anything unless they are monetarily incentivized by employment prospects or outright money of some sort.

I would also say it is probably better to craft your product/service on third world countries like India or China which might have easier barriers to crack and at the same time these countries might be responsive to a disruptive ed tech idea as these emerging powers seek to compete with the USA's education dominance.

Re: Worst Ed-Tech Debacles of the Decade

#48
The author seems to miss the boat super hard on

> 6. "Everyone Should Learn to Code"

Her argument seems to be that teaching more kids to code, will result in more people ending up in a toxic tech industry. This may be true. But the tech industry will never, ever change until we expose more kids to engineering as a choice. If we can cause a greater number and diversity of children and young adults to consider engineering as a career, the industry will be more diverse. this seems like a bit of a no-brainer.

Also the reaction to the Hour of Code makes me question whether or not the author has every lead or observed one in a meaningful way. Having led literally hundreds, almost every single one that I was involved with resulted in at least one student saying "I didn't think that this was for me / for people like me, but I really liked it". That makes it worth it. Hearing that one single time, makes every single HoC ever worth it in my opinion. I know a lot of teachers that would agree. Nobody on earth thinks kids are making significant progress towards mastery of programming from an hour of code -- it's about exposing every child and letting them know that they are capable of a career that is often, for a variety of reasons, seen as "not for them".

Re: Worst Ed-Tech Debacles of the Decade

#49
post #12

Instead of buying more/better equipment, teachers, or technology why hasn't anyone tried to buy a better student? I'm fairly certain that if you paid elementary students cash for better grades you would see a huge jump in achievement for the average student. A small amount of money to us feels like a huge amount to a kid, and there are plenty of studies showing that rewards increase performance for basic and mechanic…

It has been tried. https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2010/4/13/students-result...

Those who don't click the link may assume that the result was unsuccessful, but FTA:

"Although critics have long argued that paying students for results can lead to a decreased interest in learning, Fryer’s new results show no evidence to justify or support these claims."

That said, the researcher found that while paying students for results didn't cause harm, they did find that what worked even better (that is, worked at all) was "when they were paid to perform specific actions, such as reading books or wearing their uniforms."

“When you are paid to do something you may not know exactly how to accomplish, it’s not clear how you respond. But if you are being offered money to do something very concrete...then that might be easier to respond to.”

Not a silver bullet as the researcher notes:

“I’m interested in what are the four or five investments that, when put together, have the potential to close the achievement gap,” Fryer said. “Incentives could be one of [them], I don’t know yet. This is the first kind of large scale experiment in urban schools on incentives, and I hope it’s not the last.”

But also I hope people don't just dismiss the idea of monetarily incentivizing children out of hand.

Re: Worst Ed-Tech Debacles of the Decade

#50
post #25

I spent years working in ed-tech, at more than one company on this list, and know people at many others. There were two overarching lessons I took from my experience. The first is that a successful educational product needs to deeply and intimately understand pedagogy and materials -- teaching and learning techniques and how they vary between students, and what kinds of materials are suitable -- deeply , I mean like…

In my opinion.. Ed-tech will never truly be successful if it is B2B and focused on teaching. The real problem to be solved is LEARNING. The goals of teaching and learning are not the same. Focusing on efficient learning means getting away from outdated methodology like tests, long-winded lectures, and more.

I agree as well. I think the computer and internet unlock new methods to teach people but these new methods are rarely used effectively. I think codecademy does a good job at at least showing that online learning can be effective.

Online teaching should have more focus on analysis of student data, more direct student interaction, more customized tools to help students learn and so on.

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