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YouTube’s Rabbit Hole of Radicalization [pdf]

arxiv.org

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Re: YouTube’s Rabbit Hole of Radicalization [pdf]

#21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which formerly moderate views do you believe are being de-normalized by "editors and academics with agendas"?

- Authoritarian ideologies, such as fascism and communism, have no place in our society and their proponents must be shunned - People should be judged (i.e. admitted to college or hired) by the content of their character and not by the color of their skin - Mass import of foreign workforce by corporations is not being done in pursuit of any high-minded ideals but to drive the wages down, and it is not something we mu…

Please don't take HN threads into ideological flamewar. We should resist going there, not jump in first thing.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: YouTube’s Rabbit Hole of Radicalization [pdf]

#22

It should be noted that this research was likely published with a specific agenda in mind: https://twitter.com/mark_ledwich/status/1210743217982803970?... > My new article explains in detail. It takes aim at the NYT (in particular, @kevinroose) who have been on myth-filled crusade vs social media. We should start questioning the authoritative status of outlets that have soiled themselves with agendas. From the linked…

> It should be noted that this research was likely published with a specific agenda in mind:

Just like the previous "study" which claimed everybody not part of the corporate media were alt-right.

These types of "research" are funded and run solely for an agenda. Primarily to push social media platforms to direct traffic to corporate media.

Also, radicalized is such an interesting word. If the saudis ran the exact same study with their definition of "radicals", I wonder how that would turn out? What if the chinese or the russians? Are their radicals the same as ours? Also, are the liberal elites' definition of radical the same as conservatives or the general population at large?

At the end of the day, it's all about "authorative" sources - an orwellian and creepy word if there ever was one.

Re: YouTube’s Rabbit Hole of Radicalization [pdf]

#23
Difficult to take this analysis seriously when CNN is categorized with The Young Turks as “Partisan Left.” Regardless of what you think of either channel the programming of these two channels is dramatically different.

The fact that the tags were manually created by the experimenters and were manually assigned by the experimenters throws the results even more into question.

Re: YouTube’s Rabbit Hole of Radicalization [pdf]

#24
This quote raises questions: "The scraped data, as well as the YouTube API, provides usa view of the recommendations presented to an anonymous account. In other words, the account has not ”watched” any videos, retaining the neutral baseline recommendations, described in further detail by YouTube in their recent paper that explains the inner workings of the recommendation algorithm[38]. One should note that the recommendations list provided to a user who has an account and who is logged into YouTube might differ from the list presented to this anonymous account."

Many discussions of radicalization talk about recommendations coming after someone has watched a number of videos.

This situation is that after N videos, the algorithm starts to see a pattern, a niche, that the user fits into and then recommends more niche content. Once the user watches the niche content, just more niche content is recommended, or that-niche and mainstream content is recommended and the mainstream content is boring.

In a sense, I don't see how a blind recommendation system could escape this situation. It seems more an inherent problem of blind recommendation systems.

What could be a better approach?

* Better education in the US and the world so people have BS detectors?

* Instead of unlabeled recommendations, the algorithm categorizes what you're seen, categorizes what it's recommending and let's the user say what category they want and remove or add categories for recommendation.

* Have more ordinary search tool and a better categorization system (Youtube is a horrible black-box now, search is terrible, recommendations is terrible, I get videos from other sites mostly).

Re: YouTube’s Rabbit Hole of Radicalization [pdf]

#25
I see the term radicalization is being brought up, do we serve ourselves by focusing on superficial presentations that won't be the same in 10 years rather than how similar everyone is: Feeling enlightened, competitive and lack consideration that their perceived "ideological adversary" is every bit vulnerable, needy, and scared as themselves?

How is this different from couple's therapy, just at long distances w/ groups?

None of them want to have a picnic and cooperate with each other. And who could blame them? They both fail to recognize each others hardships, yet "get" the human condition better than the other so much better. They begin by insinuating there's another group that has a character flaw, and is so angry. Yet - all the while, they're angry and accusing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Projective_identification)

I have a hypothesis: It's all acting out, cathartic, to blow off steam. They're not at the soup kitchen or volunteering. They have a dysfunctional coping mechanism stemming from earlier traumas, and it's more profitable to captivate lonely, bored people by stir up people's anxiety existentially than help them find common ground.

Because if people realized the common ground they shared and cooperated, people would start to pass laws and regulations to make healthcare, employment, housing, education for more fair for legal persons. The whole concept of political sides is a sham: They are legal persons and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow%27s_hierarchy_of_needs.

If common sense stuff isn't being fixed and people are bikeshedding: the fix is in, people in suits are giving each other high fives and laughing at you. You're being suckered into squandering your political rights (you voted, or can!) to take worthless, symbolic digs at people rather than get what you need, better laws for the practical issues everyone shares. Hint: they tend to be boring.

Re: YouTube’s Rabbit Hole of Radicalization [pdf]

#26
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which formerly moderate views do you believe are being de-normalized by "editors and academics with agendas"?

As a “libertarian”, I have to hold my tongue and smile in most conversations. The Overton Window has become so shockingly small, that most “normals” educated in the last 20 or so years no longer even realize that they have been mentally neutered.

I mean, of all the different libertarian philosophies, most of them are radical, in so much as they all seek to distance the individual from systems of government and social institutions. Since those things are what most people use day to day, and in the US only one of the two political parties leans that way, it does put you in a minority camp whose views can be felt as a sort of existential threat. (And honestly, politics and religion should both be kept out of most conversations)

Re: YouTube’s Rabbit Hole of Radicalization [pdf]

#27

For the convenience of those who can't conveniently read a PDF on their current device: > The role that YouTube and its behind-the-scenes recommendation algorithm plays in encouraging online radicalization has been suggested by both journalists and academics alike. This study directly quantifies these claims by examining the role that YouTubes algorithm plays in suggesting radicalized content. After categorizing near…

This should be the top comment of the thread.

Re: YouTube’s Rabbit Hole of Radicalization [pdf]

#28

Difficult to take this analysis seriously when CNN is categorized with The Young Turks as “Partisan Left.” Regardless of what you think of either channel the programming of these two channels is dramatically different. The fact that the tags were manually created by the experimenters and were manually assigned by the experimenters throws the results even more into question.

I don't follow your logic. Yes, CNN and TYT are very different. This only means they can be tagged differently, but it doesn't mean they cannot be tagged under same category.

For example, The Selfish Gene and Advanced Algebra are two very different books, but they can be both categorized as nonfiction.

Maybe you are right with the conclusion, i.e. CNN or TYT should not be both categorized as “Partisan Left,” but you need a better reason.

Re: YouTube’s Rabbit Hole of Radicalization [pdf]

#29

Difficult to take this analysis seriously when CNN is categorized with The Young Turks as “Partisan Left.” Regardless of what you think of either channel the programming of these two channels is dramatically different. The fact that the tags were manually created by the experimenters and were manually assigned by the experimenters throws the results even more into question.

CNN and TYT are both partisan left. They both published content showing extreme dismay at the election of Trump. That's fine, they're allowed to do that. This just shows their political bias. The same way Fox was airing pro-Trump things at the same time. This isn't a dispute over whether they are right, just over what type of content they publish. I see no problem putting CNN and TYT on the same side of the political spectrum.

EDIT: Downvotes? Give me a counter example that shows how TYT or CNN is not left-leaning.

Re: YouTube’s Rabbit Hole of Radicalization [pdf]

#30
> with slant towards left-leaning or politically neutral channels

So ... YouTube is actually politically biased? This would be an interesting study to continue. You would need to normalise for view counts etc. since I suspect there is a bias just in terms of numbers. The biggest channels are more progressive, left leaning, so YouTube could appear left-biased simply by recommending most-viewed videos.

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