Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback • Hacker News Board

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#221

Post by boring_twenties » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 6:40 AM UTC

NullPrefix wrote: post #215

boring_twenties wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting, when I worked at Bloomberg we had a standard form letter for rejections that was sent every time. (Email) Funny story about that, I'd set up a macro to fire off said email with one keypress. Finishing up a phone screen that went horribly, I thanked him for his time and all the other niceties, and pressed the key right as I was about to hang up. "But wait! I have some questions for you, too!" Cue the long…

Couldn't you just say the same thing over the phone? Or do you need to keep the mask on during the call? As if the rejection is only possible in the next turn.

24-year-old me didn't create the process, I just followed it. Well except for the part about waiting until the call is really over ;)

After reading some of the comments here about candidates who want to debate the interviewer's decision, it seems to make sense.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#222

Post by brendanw » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 6:51 AM UTC

hinkley wrote: post #72

wgerard wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not meant to be a benefit for the company, other than good PR I suppose. It's meant to be a gesture of good faith towards the candidate that invested their time and energy to interviewing with you, i.e. at least the candidate didn't walk away with nothing from the process.

Many many years ago I applied at IOActive as a security hobbyist on the off-chance they were willing to take a chance on someone trying to switch specialties. They were not, but they were super, super nice about it. I was on all their email lists and they would reach out from time to time. In fact the founder took me out to lunch at least three years later just to catch up and see where I was. He didn't have to do an…

In my last cycle of interviewing in SF, I ran into two folks I had interviewed in the past. Both very strong interviewers in that I could sense they were putting their full energy into collaborating with me. I remember thinking I really hope I was as gracious of an interviewer. I don't think I have ever been an asshole, but I felt guilty because I have gone into interviews at 70%. SF is small too.

For those curious, the two companies were Coinbase and Envoy. Interviewers at both companies were across the board superb.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#223

Post by strathmeyer » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 6:51 AM UTC

I assume companies don't explain why they aren't hiring you because it would cause too much self-realization at the organizational level.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#224

Post by cygaril » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 6:58 AM UTC

adamredwoods wrote: post #122

CapmCrackaWaka wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel that most of the time candidates just want to hear something that puts the situation out of their control, and therefore wasn't merit based. It's always easier to hear "I'm breaking up with you because I'm moving for a new job and want to concentrate on my career" than "I'm breaking up with you because you're awkward around my friends and aren't interesting".

Rejection is incredibly difficult to deal with. I suspect some people will say they are immune to it, but (anecdotal example) I've been rejected from hundreds of jobs over the past 3 years and every one hurts a little. I felt it never got easier to deal with rejection, but it got easier to interview and move on. Perhaps it's not the rejection, but the energy in creating the next steps I need to take (more resumes, ta…

I agree that rejection is always tough. I spent a year manoeuvring to be made redundant from a job I wanted to leave (e.g. told my boss I wanted to go, made sure everything I did was covered by other people). And still, when they did finally let me go, the rejection did hurt quite a bit.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#225

Post by gunshai » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 7:06 AM UTC

thaumasiotes wrote: post #37

timw4mail wrote: post #11

This really explains why the last time I did job hunting it was such a stab in the dark for 6 months. Job hunting in general is terrible.

I applied to HackerOne to do the exact same job I'd already been doing for a year. They rejected me with the feedback "we asked you why you wanted to work for us, and you didn't seem enthusiastic about the company". (My answer to "why did you apply?" was "it's a good match to the work I was already doing".)

I spend a fare amount of time on this question and it does get annoying it's usually some version of the following.

Hiring Manager : "Why this company."

Me: "Carefully choreographed pile of horse shit that is rehearsed to sound genuine / personal, but doesn't over share or reveal accidental character flaws."

My brain: I get it company you do "things" and along the way someone pays you money for them or it or w.e. Why should anyone be over the moon about this. I'm here because I think I can do what ever vague role description you posted. Stop asking this question, it doesn't reveal anything because we are all lying.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#226

Post by icelancer » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 7:07 AM UTC

Iv wrote: post #175

exabrial wrote: post #158

I would love to be able tell applicants why we didn't choose them to help them along in their job search or clear up any misconceptions. There problem is it is a risk to a business with 0 chance of making it more profitable. Chalk this up as overregulation at it's finest having predictable secondary affects.

But you are not your business. There are more things to life than making profits, like helping fellow humans. If the risk is very low and the cost basically null, doing nice things is a positive externality.

But the risk is not very low when you adjust for magnitude of secondary effects.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#227

Post by throwaway1928 » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 7:07 AM UTC

I was rejected by a pretty well-known DB startup over a fizzbuzz-level coding assignment. I didn't blow it off because of its triviality--quite the opposite, I gold-plated it with spec comments, code comments, computational complexity comments, unit tests, type annotations, etc. I showed it to some friends at FAANG companies and they couldn't understand why it was rejected either. It was just really weird and unsettling to be rejected over a trivial test when I know I'm capable of so much more (I've eg implemented major features in a production MPP database engine). It might be partly due to their resume-blind process, which I support in principle, but it seems weird to disregard 20 years of mostly non-trivial software development when evaluating someone on a trivial test.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#228

Post by schrijver » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 7:19 AM UTC

> It wasn’t always like this. In the past, it was standard protocol to provide feedback and constructive criticism to candidates. The hiring manager or human resources professional would diplomatically let the applicants know what they did well and the areas in which they need to improve upon.

As far as I can tell, this is still the case in Belgium and the Netherlands for everyone who makes it to the interview stage. It would be considered very rude to have someone go through the associated stress and logistical hassle otherwise. Is this a U.S. trend for now?

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#229

Post by NaCl_af » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 7:21 AM UTC

bdowling wrote: post #181

wgerard wrote: post #10

We interviewed a lot of hiring managers/etc. while we were working on a previous business in the hiring space. As part of that, we asked them this very question. The fear of litigation was by far the biggest reason we heard, but there were some other popular reasons (mostly relating around conflict avoidance): * Notably, giving feedback feels like an opening for the candidate to submit a rebuttal instead of ending th…

Here's another one: * We already had a candidate in mind but our hiring process requires us to publicly post the opening and interview other candidates before we hire the person we already decided on.

Yuuuuup

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#230

Post by jeffdavis » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 7:33 AM UTC

monksy wrote: post #178

jeffdavis wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A phone call is considered more respectful than an email. It may waste time, but signs of respect often do.

No way man. Being terminated by phone or in person is respectful compared to email. Being rejected by phone for something that for most times is going to not be successful, that's just twisting the knife. At the moment I don't know how to respond to call requests when it's not successful. I fear that saying: "Hey if this is a rejection, I would prefer to just get an email. I understand."

Like it or not, a phone call is considered more respectful. Respectful doesn't mean easy, pleasant, or efficient. And the standards for respect are not set by any one person; they've evolved over a long time.