Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback • Hacker News Board

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#181

Post by bdowling » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 4:12 AM UTC

wgerard wrote: post #10

We interviewed a lot of hiring managers/etc. while we were working on a previous business in the hiring space. As part of that, we asked them this very question. The fear of litigation was by far the biggest reason we heard, but there were some other popular reasons (mostly relating around conflict avoidance): * Notably, giving feedback feels like an opening for the candidate to submit a rebuttal instead of ending th…

Here's another one:

* We already had a candidate in mind but our hiring process requires us to publicly post the opening and interview other candidates before we hire the person we already decided on.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#182

Post by HALtheWise » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 4:14 AM UTC

lostapathy wrote: post #99

tpmx wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this case, the failed candidate started detailing things we had done "wrong" in a very detailed and also entirely incorrect way. (Again: our problem was that we were mostly recruiting from a small, geographically localized online forum.) People in general are naturally curious about details of what's supposed to be a block box procedure. So they'll be drawn like a moth to flame like to something like this, even if…

Do you really think the failed candidate wouldn't also have lashed out at your company had you just ghosted him after the interview and not told him he was rejected? There's a good chance he/she would have been even angrier by the time they decided they were out of the running.

I think they would be reluctant to publicly lash out if they think they're still some possibility they're in the running. After that time, hopefully it has been long enough that their emotions have died to down.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#183

Post by ben509 » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 4:19 AM UTC

BuddyKallipygos wrote: post #57

I just went through this process looking for a job in a VP of Engineering role after spending the last 15 years running my own startups and doing my own hiring. And man it really made me rethink how I will do hiring going forward. Feedback as a candidate would be great, but based on my own experience hiring it’s difficult to have that conversation go well. Maybe 1 in 10 people would say “hey thanks, I appreciate the…

Here's a thought: maybe do most of the feedback during the interview process.

Train interviewers to explain their reasoning for the questions they're asking and what they're trying to evaluate.

And then, at the close, identify all the positive things the candidate demonstrated and what bullet points they're going to bring to the debrief.

I've been doing the former quite routinely, and in the last interview I did, the candidate just asked me why I asked those questions so I went ahead and explained it.

I think it helps make an interview less nerve wracking, and it helps me to think aloud about the case I'm going to present in the debrief.

And, frankly, some interviewers are asking stupid questions and it may help if they have to explain themselves.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#184

Post by zebnyc » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 4:22 AM UTC

As an interviewee, I would love companies to provide some transparency and feedback. The feedback doesn't have to be super detailed, just areas for improvement. This was something which I really appreciated about Facebook. I interviewed onsite a year back and later the recruiter told me "You did well in all the coding interviews but we felt that you did not display the level of competency required in System design for a senior role". That was actionable feedback IMHO and I would not hesitate to interview again.

The flip side is I hate interviewing for companies which ghost / refuse to provide feedback, especially when they give you a take home test / assignment where you don't even know a) Whether a human / engineer saw your submission b) What is the criteria being used for evaulation (especially for working solutions). The worst offender has to be Slack (though Twilio/Amazon is right up there) where they make you create a slack bot which does something trivial (play tic-tac-toe). Wasted a bunch of time to read the documentation and get a basic bot working before I got to actually work on the problem (tic tac toe). My submission was rejected and I was given no feedback / reason why

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#185

Post by woutr_be » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 4:24 AM UTC

How do people here feel about feedback for technical tests that take at least a couple of hours?

Personally I don't care if I'm not given feedback after a phone interview, or even an on-site interview.

But when it comes to technical tests, I would really appreciate feedback, since it could actually help me improve my coding skills, or at least know where I need to improve. If I'm not given feedback on these, it's just another red flag to me, the company doesn't value my time, and seems to treat the interview process as a one way street.

I recently was asked to do a coding test, the HR person told me to do it over the weekend, as most candidates needed all the time they can get. I told HR I was only willing to spend around 4 hours on it, they could judge me on whatever I could do in that time. And even working for free for 4 hours was as stretch, after all, I'm not getting paid, there are other things I could've been doing. And to this day they haven't even acknowledged my test, I did get through to the next round, but no mention of my test whatsoever.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#186

Post by woutr_be » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 4:27 AM UTC

paul7986 wrote: post #137

In October I had one of my best phone interviews. I never heard back yet other recruiters keep contacting me about the job. Today a recruiter got back to me saying oh yes they interviewed you and they said you have too much graphic design experience and not enough UX. Huh I've been a UX Designer and UI Developer for ten years. Not helpful and their reason has to be personal, so they just say nothing or as today were…

I've been rejected from engineering roles for those reasons as well. From my experience, it's just people looking at your resume, rather than actually trying to understand the candidate.

In my case it was because I studied design in college (it was actually design + development), and my first roles were mostly front-end. Even though I passed their backend test, they still just treated me based on my resume, and assume I could only do front-end engineering.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#187

Post by shortandsweet » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 4:32 AM UTC

lonelappde wrote: post #176

ticmasta wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about the fact that there's absolutely no upside for a hiring company/manager to give feedback? It's all potential downside...

Facebook gave (gives?) feedback. It's good PR in the candidate community, not just bet candidates like it, but because it promotes Facebook's reputation as a fearless company that does what they believe in regardless of conventional wisdom.

Uh no they don't. At least not in all cases. They refused to give me feedback after requesting it. I even asked an inside friend to follow up with the recruiter.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#188

Post by burtonator » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 4:38 AM UTC

gwbas1c wrote: post #83

As a candidate, I've always preferred polite "thanks, but no thanks" responses in a timely manner. The other kind of feedback that I like is things like, "we need people with a different background / experience than you have." IMO, judgement feedback (you screwed up how you handle your yak shaving, or I don't think we'll get along with each other) is too subjective to be constructive. And, I get it. As someone who's…

My worst interview was where the interviewer started yelling at me.

After the interview the recruiter sent me an email and told me that he wouldn't work with me anymore as I was hostile during the interview.

It was insanely bizarre. It was like being found guilty without ever even being given a trial or being told there was a trial.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#189

Post by conductr » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 4:39 AM UTC

adamredwoods wrote: post #126

beezle wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a societal problem and not just employer/jobseeker. "Friends" and aquaintances do it now. Vendors/contractors/trades people do it. Only a matter of time before our pets ghost us too.

With all the means to communicate with one another, are we getting better or worse at it?

All the means reinforce impersonal interaction

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#190

Post by mc32 » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 4:42 AM UTC

mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #141

gwbas1c wrote: post #83

As a candidate, I've always preferred polite "thanks, but no thanks" responses in a timely manner. The other kind of feedback that I like is things like, "we need people with a different background / experience than you have." IMO, judgement feedback (you screwed up how you handle your yak shaving, or I don't think we'll get along with each other) is too subjective to be constructive. And, I get it. As someone who's…

> “It's safer to pass on a good candidate than hire a bad employee.” After a decade of building teams in machine learning, I regard this as one of those hallowed mythical pieces of wisdom that is just totally wrong. It dramatically over-estimates both the chances and costs of hiring a bad employee, while discounting the huge, huge opportunity cost of not hiring rare, exceptional candidates. I’d much rather spend a ye…

A large company can afford bad hires. You can shuffle them around or find something they can do.

A small company can not afford that luxury so they have to be more careful in their hiring. A bad hire completely distracts a small team.