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JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised

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Re: JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised

#641

Post by dang »

randomidiot666 wrote: post #531
dang wrote: post #529

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"You are delusional and immature" is the kind of attack we ban accounts for, especially when they have a history of breaking the site guidelines.

If you actually read his comment, I think you'll agree this was an accurate and fair assessment. I've worked with those kids who believe they're super smart and others are simpletons purely based on tool preferences.

You don't have nearly enough information to draw that conclusion about someone from an internet comment. However, even if you're right, it misses the point. The point isn't that you owe $commenter better, it's that you owe the community better. Personal attacks poison the well and invite others to do worse. The community here is fragile. If you want to participate, you need to help preserve it, not help destroy it.

Re: JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised

#642

Post by gumby »

mehrdadn wrote: post #558
debaserab2 wrote: post #545

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think a lot of the steps listed in your first example are as painful as you make them about to be. Most of those steps are just as elementary as clicking a button in a GUI to someone with fluency on the CLI. I also doubt the claims that it's that much faster for someone with a lot of experience doing it. Perhaps you could be faster with the GUI than on the CLI, but learning a GUI doesn't come with zero overhe…

> I don't think a lot of the steps listed in your first example are as painful as you make them about to be. Most of those steps are just as elementary as clicking a button in a GUI to someone with fluency on the CLI. I also doubt the claims that it's that much faster for someone with a lot of experience doing it. I mean, it's not like you can ever convince me that >10 keystrokes are as fast as 1 click, but regardles…

> I mean, it's not like you can ever convince me that >10 keystrokes are as fast as 1 click,

I know your reply was to debasarab2 and my upstream comment did say YMMV, but in fact it is a lot faster for me (and likely debasarab2) to type 10 characters than click an icon. My working mode is simply different. We’re not saying you’re wrong, what we’re saying is it’s not universal.

If I Haase to click a button I have to move a hand off the keyboard, shift my gaze, find the mouse pointer, move it, then BT my hand back to the keyboard.

Whereas on a command line I always know where my keystrokes go, I never have to move my hands or look away from the screen, and I have >40 years of typing at computers wired into my basal ganglia. (This is despite the fact that the first computer I used, a CADR lisp machine, had a mouse and bitmap display). GUI interfaces are simply much slower for me, except in very unusual applications. I am not claiming it to be universal but it is clear the affordances of the command line are significantly lower-friction for people accustomed to them.

Re: JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised

#643

Post by mehrdadn »

gumby wrote: post #642
mehrdadn wrote: post #558

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't think a lot of the steps listed in your first example are as painful as you make them about to be. Most of those steps are just as elementary as clicking a button in a GUI to someone with fluency on the CLI. I also doubt the claims that it's that much faster for someone with a lot of experience doing it. I mean, it's not like you can ever convince me that >10 keystrokes are as fast as 1 click, but regardles…

> I mean, it's not like you can ever convince me that >10 keystrokes are as fast as 1 click, I know your reply was to debasarab2 and my upstream comment did say YMMV, but in fact it is a lot faster for me (and likely debasarab2) to type 10 characters than click an icon. My working mode is simply different. We’re not saying you’re wrong, what we’re saying is it’s not universal. If I Haase to click a button I have to m…

My hands are on the keyboard most of the time too, I'm not a particularly slow typer, and there's no way I could write a proper git checkout-index command at the speed of just a click or two.

But again: I will believe you if you measure it and report back. So far the only person who's measured anything has been me, and I have to wonder why others are so averse to it.

Re: JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised

#644

Post by dang »

SmirkingRevenge wrote: post #400
Zetoke wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I'm sure the much lower salaries in Prague allowed them to be more competitive with a lower burn rate It's a russian company with the most people (especially engineers) in St. Petersburg. It's only technically registered in Prague. They have only 50 people there. And around a thousand people distributed across Russia (St. Petersburg, Moscow, Novosibirsk), Munich, Boston and brand new office in Amsterdam.

I never knew they were a Russian company. That kind of makes me rethink my support, this day and age. Trusting a Russian company for such fundamental tooling seems really unwise.

Please don't take HN threads into nationalistic flamewar.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised

#645

Post by isbvhodnvemrwvn »

y0y wrote: post #39
hyperbovine wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank Java.

The new breed of garbage collectors may change this significantly for the better. They need to be explicitly enabled, but there is a GC (G1) that may be better suited for desktop applications (low latency pauses, relinquishes memory to the OS more frequently while idle, etc.) available in Java 11.

They are all concurrent GCs though. You pay for the lower pauses with significant throughput hits.

Re: JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised

#646

Post by andybak »

gdxhyrd wrote: post #487
andybak wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the model is simple and intuitive I nearly spat out my drink. Git is many things but those aren't the first two words that would leap into my head.

Git model is simple. What is complex is the hundred features and commands it provides on top of that model.

> Git model is simple.

I strongly disagree.

Let's list just basic git concepts that you're likely to encounter fairly early on: the working tree, staged commits, branches, remotes, stashes, detached heads, tags, submodules, merge conflicts, squashed commits, fast-forwards, rebasing, cherry-picking.

Some of these you could choose to ignore - rebasing and submodules - but on the whole you need at least a cursory understanding of everything on that list to get by without a git angel to get you out of trouble. I still have a person I phone when anything out of the ordinary happens and I've taught git to other people!

Re: JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised

#647

Post by mkopinsky »

jtms wrote: post #618
jakobegger wrote: post #477

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also switched from Tower when they introduced subscription pricing. My current git setup: - Git Fork for committing, pushing - P4 Merge for resolving conflicts (it's not a pretty app, but the fantastic feature set more than makes up for the non-native look) - GitUp for reordering, editing and splitting commits - Command line for the rare things the GUIs can't do None of those cost money and I don't understand how t…

The terminal is the best and only git client you need and it will always be free. You are doing yourself a disservice as a developer by not learning how to use your terminal

I'm typically a heavy terminal user. Git is my exception. a) the UI of git cli is just so terrible that I'd rather fill my brain with more important things, and b) for viewing what's changed, `git diff` just doesn't cut it relative to a GUI.

Sourcetree is my go to git client, but if I couldn't use sourcetree I'd be OK with pretty much any git GUI. But git CLI is reserved for particularly tricky things that GUIs just can't handle well. (And I need to look up the specific flags or commands every single time.)

Re: JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised

#648

Post by traskjd »

michaelfeathers wrote: post #266

The thing I love about JetBrains is their ethic. - Started by making refactoring plugins for IDEs. Became irritated by those IDEs. Wrote their own IDE. - Supported various programming languages. Became irritated by those languages. Made their own programming language.

I think you mean 'started with an RSS reader' - omea reader was ace :)

Re: JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised

#649

Post by Gene_Parmesan »

nindalf wrote: post #85
dmitryminkovsky wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I came to say this. That $270M revenue is backed by a #1 product line. I first tried PHPStorm back in 2014 after I got tired of the wonky debugging capability in Eclipse. I still think Eclipse is a really important project in the way that JetBrains is the Google of IDEs and Eclipse is maybe the Firefox, and we need Firefoxes.

Man why you gotta do Firefox dirty like that? Firefox is absolutely the best browser IMO. Unlike Eclipse, which is acceptable but doesn’t hold a candle to JetBrains.

Mozilla has made a commitment to privacy into its products' main differentiator, and I am 100% okay with that. The fact that FF ships with its Facebook container system turned on by default, and that it just works, is probably my favorite browser feature in quite some time.

Re: JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised

#650

Post by zmmmmm »

xtracto wrote: post #506
zmmmmm wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm like the parent ... Eclipse provides an omniscient view of all my work with instant incremental compilation across all my projects, spanning PHP, JavaScript, Python, Java, Groovy, Kotlin, and more. Run with enough memory it just becomes like another part of my brain. When I use IntelliJ I feel like I'm using a nice tool with a lot of sweet superficial features but lacking the comprehensiveness and the underlying…

Really interesting description, thanks. How does current Eclipse compare to Netbeans? I currently use vim and VSCode, but in my Java years (10 years ago) I remember moving from Eclipse to Netbeans mainly for the form builder and because of performance.

It's bean so long since I used NetBeans that I can't make a good comparison unfortunately. I do know it never surpassed eclipse for me but some of the reasons for that were probably circumstantial at the time (eg: whole team was using eclipse, etc).
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