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Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

citylab.com

191–200 of 286 posts

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#191

San Francisco had one street block near Union Square closed off for a looong time because of construction, and they put some fake turf on it. Occasionally there would be pop-up events, like a little Christmas fair. I would deliberately walk slightly out of my way to go up that block because it meant no cars and wayyy more room to walk. I loved it and was so disappointed to see it turned into a normal street again. Si…

That was Stockton street, which stretches from Market Street (heart of downtown) to Pier 39 (heart of tourist district).

Three blocks north of Union Square is a tunnel that burrows under China Town/Nob Hill and emerges in North Beach. It's a pretty critical artery for locals as it flattens the route between market st and the northern coastline of the city.

There was a push to permanently close Stockton St in favor of making it pedestrian only, but as Stockton St (and the tunnel) is the (real) gateway to the heart of China Town, that movement was squashed pretty quickly.

That said, I would love to see maybe 10% of the streets north of Market street turned into pedestrian-only, or reduced to one lane, converting the parking on both sides of the street into wider sidewalks and more trees. As dense as Nob/Russian Hill is, only one lane is really needed to service most of these neighborhoods. Retailers claim they need the parking but only once in five years have I driven to a market in Nob Hill.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cars kill ~40000 Americans annually. Is that cheap? Criticizing cars is the only way to wake people up to the damage they have caused in our society. Sure, cars are wonderful for people with mobility issues. For the vast majority of us to design our cities around two ton death machines is a tragedy. Our cities would be dramatically cheaper to live in with fewer cars. Less parking and road space allows higher density.…

> Criticizing cars is the only way to wake people up to the damage they have caused in our society. It's a way to make you look like an out-of-touch loony, who therefore gets ignored. If you want to reduce car use in the US, dial down the rhetoric, and work on increasing the convenience of not using a car. You're going to win more hearts and minds by making available something better than you are by constantly carpin…

There is value on both ends. If you are too kind and effeminate on the causes you care about, no one will listen to you either and will think it doesn't matter. You need a mix of both voices in any movement.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cars kill ~40000 Americans annually. Is that cheap? Criticizing cars is the only way to wake people up to the damage they have caused in our society. Sure, cars are wonderful for people with mobility issues. For the vast majority of us to design our cities around two ton death machines is a tragedy. Our cities would be dramatically cheaper to live in with fewer cars. Less parking and road space allows higher density.…

> Criticizing cars is the only way to wake people up to the damage they have caused in our society. It's a way to make you look like an out-of-touch loony, who therefore gets ignored. If you want to reduce car use in the US, dial down the rhetoric, and work on increasing the convenience of not using a car. You're going to win more hearts and minds by making available something better than you are by constantly carpin…

I keep training equipment in my car which is not allowed in my workplace. Unless work changes to allow them, not having a car to keep them in just isn't tenable. I was informed in an earlier HN discussion that in some states, they would not even legally be permitted to make such a change.

And that's even assuming that it would be allowed on public transportation.

It would be good to hear some kind of solution, rather than just being swept under the rug. Or pushed under the bus, so to speak.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the technological and class divide will only widen. Car friendly infrastructure widens the technological and class divide. They create a base state where you are required to own and maintain an expensive piece of equipment in order to be an equal member of society. You are required to have parking for those cars, both at home and at your work. Forcing people to pay thousands of dollars per year to participate in so…

>Car friendly infrastructure widens the technological and class divide. They create a base state where you are required to own and maintain an expensive piece of equipment in order to be an equal member of society. Great, so if we can't all have something, none of us should have it! Forget the fact that the vast majority of families own and benefit from personal transportation, the important thing is that we're all e…

You can have a high average but have the majority of people suffer, just have a really long tail. I don't think you meant what you said.

Regardless, your arguments that public good doesn't matter also nullifies the OP comments argument of widening the class divide by claiming class divides don't matter and should not be ameliorated.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#195

The only real reason why we don't have car-free side streets in Philly (the ones that are too skinny for a car to get through anyway, forcing people to park on one of the sidewalks) is due to handicapped people becoming immobilized. I like the concept, but I'm curious how it will be implemented whilst also solving the problems for a large percentage of the population...

I might be way off base, but wouldn't those people have electric wheelchairs or something similar?

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#196
post #90

Yeah, I live in Berlin and we have an increasing number of car free zones here where people can move around without being afraid of getting killed. Even children play outside again in such areas without risking their life. Not to mention the lack of noise, pollution and clogged up space with parking cars. Cafes thrive and people stroll around to spend their time and money. Businesses return from the outskirts etc. It…

This only works in bigger cities, where there is plenty of heavily subsidized public transport such as Berlin. Most smaller towns that went car free killed their businesses or made them move to shopping districts on the outskirts which are still reachable by car. Leading to "dead" inner parts of town and very unhappy citizens. Oh, and skyrocketing rents in the subsidized cities such as Berlin...

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the technological and class divide will only widen. Car friendly infrastructure widens the technological and class divide. They create a base state where you are required to own and maintain an expensive piece of equipment in order to be an equal member of society. You are required to have parking for those cars, both at home and at your work. Forcing people to pay thousands of dollars per year to participate in so…

Not to mention making a car a requirement for transportation doesn't just exclude those who can't afford it - it excludes children, teenagers, elderly and disabled who can't get a license or car themselves.

A small thing, but to grind my own political axe here, but a topic that comes up a lot on HN is infantalization of the youth in America. I personally believe that sprawl (forcing children and teens to stay home since they really can't go anywhere if they can't drive) helps perpetuate it reducing their agency. It also as dashundchen leads to isolate elderly people and people with disabilities.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#198

The only real reason why we don't have car-free side streets in Philly (the ones that are too skinny for a car to get through anyway, forcing people to park on one of the sidewalks) is due to handicapped people becoming immobilized. I like the concept, but I'm curious how it will be implemented whilst also solving the problems for a large percentage of the population...

It depends but having kneeling buses helps.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would picture a Berlin drug dealer as being perfectly comfortable riding a bicycle.

Most street drug dealers use bicycles, EU and abroad. More freedom of movement, no license nor plate.

Drug dealers in Berlin populate the parks and subway stations mostly. Easier to hide in the crowds or shrubbery, if they hide at all. Police usually never bother them.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#200
post #196
post #90

Yeah, I live in Berlin and we have an increasing number of car free zones here where people can move around without being afraid of getting killed. Even children play outside again in such areas without risking their life. Not to mention the lack of noise, pollution and clogged up space with parking cars. Cafes thrive and people stroll around to spend their time and money. Businesses return from the outskirts etc. It…

This only works in bigger cities, where there is plenty of heavily subsidized public transport such as Berlin. Most smaller towns that went car free killed their businesses or made them move to shopping districts on the outskirts which are still reachable by car. Leading to "dead" inner parts of town and very unhappy citizens. Oh, and skyrocketing rents in the subsidized cities such as Berlin...

Well yeah, if you get rid of one form of transport there has to be something sufficient to replace it. They could be subways, busses, bikes (think Denmark), etc.
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