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Apple responds: we want a cut of Amazon, Sony e-book sales

arstechnica.com

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Re: Apple responds: we want a cut of Amazon, Sony e-book sales

#101

Post by charlesju »

YooLi wrote: post #84
charlesju wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gramatically you might be correct, but effectually ars is correct. You will not be allowed to access the content if Kindle does not allow you to buy books through IAP. That is exactly what ars is trying to communicate.

Explain how? Where is Apple saying you can't access content not purchased through them? All I see if Apple saying if the apps sends users someplace else to purchase, then the app should also allow them to purchase from inside the app. There is nothing about what content can and can't be accessed.

"We are now requiring that if an app offers customers the ability to purchase books outside of the app, that the same option is also available to customers from within the app with in-app purchase."

The only way you can get access to premium content on the Kindle is through PURCHASING. Apple is implying that you can only access content that has the capacity to be purchased in iOS.

Re: Apple responds: we want a cut of Amazon, Sony e-book sales

#102

Post by JunkDNA »

ruchi wrote: post #92
JunkDNA wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or possibility number 4: Amazon removes any mention of purchasing books from the app. The way I read the statement from Apple, they are not saying that if developers offer purchasing outside the app, then they must offer in-app purchasing. They are saying that if an app offers purchasing options, those have to go through the in-app purchasing model. It's still pretty crappy, but basically, all Amazon would have to do…

I'm not sure that's right. Even if Kindle App has no purchasing option but accesses content bought on Amazon.com, it should still allow Apple's in-app purchase. Which essentially means, Kindle app is useless. See the excerpt below. >> If an app lets users access content that they purchased via Amazon's website, for example, then that same app must also let users buy the same book via Apple's own in-app purchase syste…

That is Ars' interpretation of Apple's position. The actual quote from Apple was (emphasis is mine):

"We are now requiring that if an app offers customers the ability to purchase books outside of the app, that the same option is also available to customers from within the app with in-app purchase."

Re: Apple responds: we want a cut of Amazon, Sony e-book sales

#104

Post by DenisM »

charlesju wrote: post #101
YooLi wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Explain how? Where is Apple saying you can't access content not purchased through them? All I see if Apple saying if the apps sends users someplace else to purchase, then the app should also allow them to purchase from inside the app. There is nothing about what content can and can't be accessed.

"We are now requiring that if an app offers customers the ability to purchase books outside of the app, that the same option is also available to customers from within the app with in-app purchase." The only way you can get access to premium content on the Kindle is through PURCHASING. Apple is implying that you can only access content that has the capacity to be purchased in iOS.

This does not mean the content has to be purchased through Apple's in-app payments. It only means that it has to be purchaseable.

That is, if an app can consume premium content, that content must be purchaseable through the app. Any individual piece of the content can be purchased through the app, or elsewhere.

Re: Apple responds: we want a cut of Amazon, Sony e-book sales

#105

Post by DenisM »

potatolicious wrote: post #36
raganwald wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not just you, but it is far more reminiscent of being every bit as greedy as console manufacturers demanding licensing fees from cartridge manufacturers (or whatever we call sharecroppers). Remember that if a developer makes an app and sells it for money, Apple gets 30% of their revenue, period, full stop. That's the App Store deal, if you don't like it, you don't develop an iOS app. So what happens when a devel…

It's a hypothetical problem that doesn't really exist in real-life. Separating people from their money is hard, quadruply so when you expect them to sign up for a new payments account. This is also why PayPal is the de facto payments platform on the internet - consumers are wary of signing up for ever more payment options. You need to be well established to have enough customer confidence to pull it off - and even th…

It depends on your margins. If your margins are 100% then yeah, the resulting drop in conversions will likely overshadow the 30% savings. However, if your profit margin is 31% due to the royalties you have to pay for the content, you're looking at 30x boost in profits. And if your margins are 29% you are looking at a difference between profit and loss.

I'm fairly sure ebooks fall into this latter category, hence the kerfuffle.

Re: Apple responds: we want a cut of Amazon, Sony e-book sales

#106

Post by megablast »

JunkDNA wrote: post #34
archgrove wrote: post #19

I can make no possible reading of the App Store guidelines that results in this policy - it's clearly new. I guess if Google can't make the Android App Store attractive to developers, Apple sure can. Surely, this cannot be "official" policy, or if it is, it can't be one that lasts more than a couple of weeks. It's not one of those geek-annoying App restrictions that 99% of the iOS target market wouldn't care about ev…

Or possibility number 4: Amazon removes any mention of purchasing books from the app. The way I read the statement from Apple, they are not saying that if developers offer purchasing outside the app, then they must offer in-app purchasing. They are saying that if an app offers purchasing options, those have to go through the in-app purchasing model. It's still pretty crappy, but basically, all Amazon would have to do…

Think about this from Apple point of view, the Kindle app is free, uses Apple infrastructure, and Apple get nothing out of it, besides the increased usefulness of their devices (which isn't tiny).

I can understand them wanting to get something for this. I am not saying that this is what they believe, because I still think it is crazy.

Re: Apple responds: we want a cut of Amazon, Sony e-book sales

#107

Post by omaranto »

archgrove wrote: post #19

I can make no possible reading of the App Store guidelines that results in this policy - it's clearly new. I guess if Google can't make the Android App Store attractive to developers, Apple sure can. Surely, this cannot be "official" policy, or if it is, it can't be one that lasts more than a couple of weeks. It's not one of those geek-annoying App restrictions that 99% of the iOS target market wouldn't care about ev…

How about option 3') add in-app purchasing with a price hike but have a bit of text suggesting the users not purchase that way but instead use their Kindles or amazon.com to get a discount!

Re: Apple responds: we want a cut of Amazon, Sony e-book sales

#108

Post by count »

megablast wrote: post #106
JunkDNA wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or possibility number 4: Amazon removes any mention of purchasing books from the app. The way I read the statement from Apple, they are not saying that if developers offer purchasing outside the app, then they must offer in-app purchasing. They are saying that if an app offers purchasing options, those have to go through the in-app purchasing model. It's still pretty crappy, but basically, all Amazon would have to do…

Think about this from Apple point of view, the Kindle app is free, uses Apple infrastructure, and Apple get nothing out of it, besides the increased usefulness of their devices (which isn't tiny). I can understand them wanting to get something for this. I am not saying that this is what they believe, because I still think it is crazy.

Apple got the $800 worth of hardware sale + ongoing monthly lock-in to ATT contract. 'nothing', hah. Apple makes a TON off it's users, without having to do anything once the phone is sold.

Re: Apple responds: we want a cut of Amazon, Sony e-book sales

#110

Post by tesseract »

JunkDNA wrote: post #102
ruchi wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure that's right. Even if Kindle App has no purchasing option but accesses content bought on Amazon.com, it should still allow Apple's in-app purchase. Which essentially means, Kindle app is useless. See the excerpt below. >> If an app lets users access content that they purchased via Amazon's website, for example, then that same app must also let users buy the same book via Apple's own in-app purchase syste…

That is Ars' interpretation of Apple's position. The actual quote from Apple was ( emphasis is mine): "We are now requiring that if an app offers customers the ability to purchase books outside of the app, that the same option is also available to customers from within the app with in-app purchase."

Doesn't any app that allows you to query an arbitrary URL or web search technically provide customers the ability to purchase books through e.g. Amazon? This way lies madness.
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