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Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

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Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#451

Post by pflats »

woodandsteel wrote: post #424
pflats wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I felt the opposite. Tesla's answer came across the worst to me, and reads to me with the over-specificity of a student making excuses for why their paper isn't done on time. > "It was a supplier-related issue". Passing the buck is really not a great look to start with. It makes the rest of the response seem like a series of excuses. Tesla chose the supplier. Tesla built and inspected and sold and shipped the car wit…

>Tesla chose the supplier. Tesla built and inspected and sold and shipped the car with those parts. This is a Tesla-related issue. They are new at mass manufacturing and no doubt learned a lesson from this incident. And that is the whole point of their response, unlike the other American manufacturers they are successfully working away at rapidly improving quality and reliability. And you are angry at them for that.

But Tesla didn't say "we're new at this and we learned from it". They said it was a "supplier-related issue" that has been "addressed for cars in the field" and "resolved [...] with fundamental design improvements".

Nothing in the statement tells me that there won't be another "supplier-related issue" down the line. There should be controls in place for this.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#452

Post by gamblor956 »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #427
jtbayly wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Excuse for what? I don’t even understand the rhetorical question.

For not building a non-internal combustion vehicle.

Toyota has been experimenting with and selling non ICE vehicles since before Tesla existed. They created the market for green cars. They were Tesla's first big contact back when Tesla was still unprotected l unproven.

Without Toyota, Tesla wouldn't exist.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#453

Post by gamblor956 »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #448
philwelch wrote: post #440

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s no sensible use case for one that isn’t more effectively satisfied with a plug-in hybrid?

Plug in hybrid is double the complexity (combustion and EV powertrains) when having a charging network negates the need for the combustion component.

Until a fire results in the power grid going down...

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#454

Post by toomuchtodo »

gamblor956 wrote: post #453
toomuchtodo wrote: post #448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plug in hybrid is double the complexity (combustion and EV powertrains) when having a charging network negates the need for the combustion component.

Until a fire results in the power grid going down...

Gas pumps stop working too when utility power is out. Can charge your electric car at home from solar if you have it (and in California, solar is mandatory on new residential roofs of new construction starting in January of next year).

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#455

Post by heymijo »

invaliddata wrote: post #432
oflannabhra wrote: post #316

I'm an American and I will probably never buy another American made car again until we switch to EV. Time for anecdotes! I'm in the process of changing our families vehicles: I've sold our Toyota Tundra and purchased a Toyota Sequoia, and I'm currently selling our Honda CR-V and will be downsizing to a Toyota Matrix or Honda Fit. The Tundra has been one of the most amazing vehicles I've ever owned. I bought it used w…

For someone who doesn't want to buy American made cars, you sure speak fondly of some of them. Tundra and Sequoia have only ever been made in the us, matrix was once upon a time made in the nummi factory that is now Tesla's, and have been made in North America since, crv have also mostly been made in the us, otherwise North American production, same with all newer fits. The only car you mentioned made outside of Nort…

It seems you and OP aren't working from a shared definition of "American made."

OP seems to have a reverence for autos made by foreign-based companies (Toyota and Honda).

While you are rightly pointing out that both Toyota and Honda manufacture in America.

The key difference in OP's enthusiasm seems to be not in location of manufacture but in company process/ethos/culture that delivers reliable vehicles.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#456

Post by Jamwinner »

gumby wrote: post #357
j8014 wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is total nonsense. I buy nearly everything either made in the US or Europe. Kitchenware, tools, outdoor equipment, clothing, furniture and just about everything else except my phone, tv and computers. It's always excellent, durable and unfortunately, expensive.

I agree about many European products (the appliances in my house are all 20 year old European ones that still work perfectly). But inexpensive "made in USA" stuff I tend to find (folding outdoor chairs and the like) seems to pretty much last a short time or even single use, and as has been lamented publicly, is rarely exported. Most of the everyday product purchases seem to come from SE Asia.

Only on the extreme low end. If you want cheap crap, there is a certain national economy geared to that, and its not the USA.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#457

Post by Dylan16807 »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #448
philwelch wrote: post #440

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s no sensible use case for one that isn’t more effectively satisfied with a plug-in hybrid?

Plug in hybrid is double the complexity (combustion and EV powertrains) when having a charging network negates the need for the combustion component.

Hybrid drivetrains can be simpler than ICE drivetrains.

Having a charging network doesn't solve all the problems of going >50 miles from home.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#458

Post by microtherion »

amyjess wrote: post #315
Marsymars wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I consider myself an enthusiast, and still consider engine noise to be undesirable. Among various other car things, I'm very enthusiastic for in-car noise cancelling: https://www.theverge.com/2019/1/9/18175748/bose-noise-cancel...

Interestingly enough, the industry is actually going the opposite direction. Engines are getting quieter externally, to avoid pissing off your neighbors (there are few things as annoying as a tuner with a fart-can exhaust driving down a residential street), but with artificial engine noise piped into the cabin via the speakers in order to give enthusiasts the noisy experience they want.

That should help with some of the fans of loud engines—those who just like listening to their own car.

But I can't shake the suspicion that a significant percentage of loudness fans want other people to listen to their vehicle (With bikers, this is explicitly acknowledged in the name of security: "Loud Pipes Save Lives").

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#459

Post by charwalker »

ranger207 wrote: post #248
blaser-waffle wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe it's just me but the infotainment systems in cars, despite being more complex, aren't really better in any meaningful way compared to my 2007 Mazda 3 (RIP). I've got a new car with a touchscreen but it's more of a PITA then hooking up an MP3 player via the aux audio.

I have an older car. I replaced the head unit with one that supports Bluetooth, and it stays on Bluetooth 24/7. I have a suction cup mount for my phone which runs GPS. That's all I need. I dread having to buy a car made in the past decade or so, purely because of way-too-intrusive infotainment systems.

What you describe is what I did to my older Outback a few years ago, replaced the aftermarket non BT stereo my older brother had in it with BT. The swap wasn't too bad and It's been working great since then.

I just got a recent year Mazda3 that came with the free (from Mazda) upgrade to Android Auto/Apple Carplay. I'm and Android guy so can't speak to Carplay but the basic functions provided by AA like music/podcast playback, navigation, and overall interface are solid even without a touch screen. In fact, I'd say the lack of touch screen is a perk as I'm not reaching out to tap something vs using the console/cup holder area interface that I picked up quickly and like (other than a so far not re-mapable star/favorites button that only goes to the Mazda audio favorites list outside of AA). It's less distracting than a mounted phone, has a bigger screen for navigation, and works really well for me. I don't think Id buy a newer car without either a basic BT stereo setup or full blown AA.

That being said, I have the trade off now of requiring a cable for AA to work otherwise I'm only on the built in BT infotainment (which I still find way better than the Toyota Corolla interface I tested out recently). I'm still used to leaving my phone in my pocket or jacket so I have to remember to pull it out and often end up leaving it plugged in and walking away (the spot where it sits is well hidden so not too worried about theft in my location). According to forums, it is possible to hook my phone to AA setup via wifi and project wirelessly with some lag which I am interested in setting up but I think I need to update the software in my unit before it can make the wifi connection.

I'm really liking the AA setup in this car. It's pretty intuitive, easy to set up and control, and feels safer than another setup with the caveat that it needs a cable. Good news is it keeps the phone charged up (the Toyota Corolla USB didn't provide enough power to charge my phone, for some reason). I would recommend it.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#460

Post by dragontamer »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #454
gamblor956 wrote: post #453

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until a fire results in the power grid going down...

Gas pumps stop working too when utility power is out. Can charge your electric car at home from solar if you have it (and in California, solar is mandatory on new residential roofs of new construction starting in January of next year).

> Gas pumps stop working too when utility power is out.

And gas pumps can be powered by diesel generators. Especially because they happen to be built on top of giant-tanks of diesel.

I mean, the Tesla Supercharger at Nuburgring was a diesel generator for this very reason. Diesel (and gasoline) takes up very little space or weight, while giving a significant amount of energy storage. So its ideal for storage, transport, and distribution.

https://www.motor1.com/news/371593/tesla-diesel-generator-nu...

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