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Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

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Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#321

Post by sabas123 »

mrpopo wrote: post #308
netok wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a chinese, this kind of comment makes me hate the west even more. I have no control over my government. Zero. 0. Do you understand the concept of 0? Thats the amount of influence I have over any government matter. And you people being racist pos because there is nothing I can do about my gov. Wtf do you want?

I am sorry that you think like that, but the government is nothing without its people. The moment you start saying there is nothing you can do is the moment you lose. Russian dissidents etc. Chinese middle-class is complacently trading freedom for comfort. American and European middle-class too, for that matter.

I feel it is really unfair to blame chinese individuals like this, can we blame American's for all of their terrible influences they have had around the world too then?

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#322

Post by computerex »

netok wrote: post #288
mb_72 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curious as the way I see it it's very often China who is the 'initiator', eg internment of Muslims, stealing of territory in South China sea, debt-trap diplomacy, and so forth. Presuming that you are aware of these occurrences, do you agree with your government's positions and actions, and - if not - what actions, if any, do you take to make it clear your opposition? The Chinese government is, IMO, massively over sen…

As a chinese, this kind of comment makes me hate the west even more. I have no control over my government. Zero. 0. Do you understand the concept of 0? Thats the amount of influence I have over any government matter. And you people being racist pos because there is nothing I can do about my gov. Wtf do you want?

No one is criticizing the Chinese people who have zero control over their authoritarian government. The Chinese people are humans just like any other person on Earth, whether from America or Canada or Nigeria or India or anywhere.

When people criticize China, they are almost universally criticizing the Chinese government, because of their double standards, shady practices, lack of respect for individual privacy/sovereignty, ethnic cleansing in xinjiang.

I love the Chinese people, whereas I hate the Chinese government.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#323

Post by DiogenesKynikos »

computerex wrote: post #318
blaesus wrote: post #225

I am Chinese living in China. Nationalism is on the rise lately in China, not just for domestic reasons, but also as an reaction to nationalistic moves from "the West" like this one. It's a recurring theme, not just in governmental propaganda, but also in daily conversations, that "the West" would talk about fairness and justice then commit blatant discrimination and double standards. As a founder of a tech company b…

Nationalism has always been high in China ever since the CCP took control. Not being a nationalist would be a good way to suddenly disappear off the face of the Earth. China has always had double standards. They make it hell for U.S companies to do business there. The only thing that has changed is that the U.S has started pushing back somewhat as of late, but things are still currently in favor of China. When China…

> They make it hell for U.S companies to do business there.

That's not evidenced by the massive presence of US companies in China. American companies do vastly more business in China than vice versa. Whenever I see these sorts of claims, I ask what specific restrictions or hurdles are being discussed.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#324

Post by _wmhc »

computerex wrote: post #318
blaesus wrote: post #225

I am Chinese living in China. Nationalism is on the rise lately in China, not just for domestic reasons, but also as an reaction to nationalistic moves from "the West" like this one. It's a recurring theme, not just in governmental propaganda, but also in daily conversations, that "the West" would talk about fairness and justice then commit blatant discrimination and double standards. As a founder of a tech company b…

Nationalism has always been high in China ever since the CCP took control. Not being a nationalist would be a good way to suddenly disappear off the face of the Earth. China has always had double standards. They make it hell for U.S companies to do business there. The only thing that has changed is that the U.S has started pushing back somewhat as of late, but things are still currently in favor of China. When China…

>realize that personal liberties, sovereignty and privacy are important to the "west"

I think that Snowden showed us that this is not actually true. Things like National Security letters and the PATRIOT act make the US to me, as a European, seem very hypocritical right now.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#325

Post by EugeneOZ »

ecmascript wrote: post #313
EugeneOZ wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in Europe and I use/consume things made in Europe every day. And instead of arguing to me, just read if protectionism was ever a good decision - just from the history. > I rather pay more for something produced in the EU than to have something shipped from China just to save a few bucks. Protectionism works quite contrary, so you do not support it anyway :)

Yes, it certainly is a good decision. For example, if we had no protections like customs China would easily subsidize any market they wish to gain monopoly of the market in question. This is happening even WITH protectionism like customs and tolls. Chinas government subsidize stuff like steel production which makes it hard for companies like SSAB in Sweden to compete with them since they sell their steel cheaper than…

One thing is a response to unfair competition and completely different - protectionism just to support local companies and give them advantage in competition - it leads to stagnation.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#326

Post by computerex »

mrpopo wrote: post #308
netok wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a chinese, this kind of comment makes me hate the west even more. I have no control over my government. Zero. 0. Do you understand the concept of 0? Thats the amount of influence I have over any government matter. And you people being racist pos because there is nothing I can do about my gov. Wtf do you want?

I am sorry that you think like that, but the government is nothing without its people. The moment you start saying there is nothing you can do is the moment you lose. Russian dissidents etc. Chinese middle-class is complacently trading freedom for comfort. American and European middle-class too, for that matter.

I think that's sending out the wrong message. There is plenty of shit that happens in the U.S and most people don't go out of the comforts of their homes after a long day of work to affect change in government. And that's in the U.S, where protest is protected by the constitution. Someone in China would be in considerable danger to speak out against the government.

The Chinese people are amazing, it is the Chinese government that is fucked up.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#327

Post by type0 »

thekevan wrote: post #252
microcolonel wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wait, am I to understand that this law says I cannot boycott doing business with businesses located in Israel? No. That link the parent commenter shared is a very good overview: it basically means that your company will not receive special corporate tax consideration if your company: Enters agreements to refuse or actually refuses to do business with or in Israel or with blacklisted companies. Enters agreements to…

>your company will not receive special corporate tax consideration if your company: >Enters agreements to refuse or actually refuses to do business with or in Israel The link does actually include the penalties, which are far more than just losing special tax considerations. It includes hefty fines and even imprisonment under the TRA. The "just losing tax consideration" part is only under the EAR. I understand that p…

Honestly, I also do not understand their wording on that. Getting on board with foreign boycott is not ok that much is clear, but exercising your freedom of affiliation as a company is fine as long as it doesn't contradict US foreign policies. So if you don't want to contradict those you shouldn't boycott them if you don't your gov deciding that your decision is not independent. I mean you never know, but stranger things have happened. Just because of that I generally advise foreign entrepreneurs to think hundreds of times over before they go ahead to open their offices in US.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#328

Post by computerex »

DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #323
computerex wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nationalism has always been high in China ever since the CCP took control. Not being a nationalist would be a good way to suddenly disappear off the face of the Earth. China has always had double standards. They make it hell for U.S companies to do business there. The only thing that has changed is that the U.S has started pushing back somewhat as of late, but things are still currently in favor of China. When China…

> They make it hell for U.S companies to do business there. That's not evidenced by the massive presence of US companies in China. American companies do vastly more business in China than vice versa. Whenever I see these sorts of claims, I ask what specific restrictions or hurdles are being discussed.

The U.S is a much bigger economy than China and that's one of the reasons why you see penetration from U.S companies in China. Just because there are U.S companies in China doesn't mean that what I said about the Chinese government making it hell to do business there is false. Your argument is not logically sound.

But as to your point, some of the things that make it difficult for western countries to do business there is the great firewall, draconian privacy laws https://www.chinalawblog.com/2019/09/chinas-new-cybersecurit...

and subsidies (both monetary and policy) from the Chinese government that make it almost impossible for foreign companies to compete against domestic companies.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#329

Post by DiogenesKynikos »

mb_72 wrote: post #282
EastToWest wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you expect a Chinese to respond to this kind of "Have you stopped beating your wife" questions? Whether some of the view points are valid in the first place (at least the second or third one) is deeply contested to Chinese. If you're just parroting Western media view points without showing at least some understanding of Chinese view points, you will likely not get any genuine answers.

I've lived in China for some time, and have sources of information other than just 'Western media'. Are you saying the article I linked in, for one example, is not accurate? Are you saying the UN is wrong with their information? I have no doubt the Chinese have a different point of view; they have much less complete information on the subjects I mentioned, and others. But, yes, of course the point is that the poster…

It's very disputable whether or not China is "stealing" territory in the South China Sea or engaging in debt-trap diplomacy. The latter accusation is mostly hypothetical at the moment, based on a general fear that Chinese loans for infrastructure investment might in the future be abused to trap poor countries in debt.

More generally, what's the point of raising these accusations? When you speak to an American, do you demand that they apologize for their government's illegal invasion of Iraq (and the ensuing hundreds of thousands of deaths) or support for Sunni radicals in Syria?

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#330

Post by computerex »

_wmhc wrote: post #324
computerex wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nationalism has always been high in China ever since the CCP took control. Not being a nationalist would be a good way to suddenly disappear off the face of the Earth. China has always had double standards. They make it hell for U.S companies to do business there. The only thing that has changed is that the U.S has started pushing back somewhat as of late, but things are still currently in favor of China. When China…

>realize that personal liberties, sovereignty and privacy are important to the "west" I think that Snowden showed us that this is not actually true. Things like National Security letters and the PATRIOT act make the US to me, as a European, seem very hypocritical right now.

There was a huge backlash against the government after Snowden. And Snowden was an American who leaked classified government information for the good of the country. Our perception of Snowden is generally very positive. If what you are saying is right, this wouldn't be the case. You don't see many Chinese whistleblowers leaking the most classified information to the vast public, for example.

The patriot act was passed after 9/11 where the people were hurt and scared. There is backlast against the Patriot act too. Besides PRISM was a highly classified program because the people wouldn't be okay with that type of surveillance here in the U.S where the expectation of privacy isn't even a thing in China.

They are two totally different worlds.

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