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Gmail marking email from me as spam

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Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#371

Post by LeonM »

aschismatic wrote: post #331
LeonM wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Judging by your username I don't expect you to share the domain name here, but if you need a second opinion, send me a PM and I'll analyse the domain for you. There is usually some misconfiguration somewhere that goes overlooked. Happens to the best of us :-)

I've thought about setting up a mail server on a DigitalOcean or Vultr VPS without any experience with mail servers (for person use). Whenever I read opinions about operating a private mail server, there's usually a few people that express great satisfaction in doing so, and say that it's not too difficult. However, there are also many more people that say it's not worth the effort since there's maintenance to consid…

Self hosting has become harder due to email abuse (spam, phishing, impersonation, etc) and the measures against this that have been introduced.

Following a guide to setup a basic email service is quite easy to do, but after a while the lack of proper implementation and maintenance of the standards will start to cause deliverability issues. Those are frustrating and most end up writing a long rant on why Google is evil because their email ended up in spam. When in fact, it usually is a misconfiguration, but those can be really hard to detect.

IMO there is still great satisfaction in running any internet service yourself. But, if you rely on this service to work, it just no longer makes financial sense to do so.

It takes resources to keep any internet service running correctly. Even the simple stuff can quickly get overlooked, I have seen so many self-hosted email servers that have expired certificates (like with the domain of the OP) or lack support for any of the modern security extensions such as DMARC or MTA-STS.

For most businesses my recommendation is not to run it yourself. Like you wouldn't run your own DNS service anymore. Of course it can be done, and in some cases it makes sense to run stuff yourself (usually when operating at a very large scale). But it almost always makes more financial sense to use a hosted email solution.

We haven't written a guide (yet) on setting up an email server with all the bells and whistles. But if you want to read more on all the email security standards, have a look here: https://www.mailhardener.com/kb/

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#372

Post by xxs »

loup-vaillant wrote: post #335
xxs wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>2. You're using Tor or a VPN? Here's 10 reCaptcha's. I get recapthca ALL the time for just not being logged on and deleting all filthy cookies on exit; and not "honoring" 3rd party cookies at all... and I don't care. Best part is that if you live in a country you don't speak the language you get google services in one of the country official languages -- so what you should do and mark is often unclear. The next best…

> (edit adding "?hl=en" to the url tends to fix the issue in most of google services) Seriously, you shouldn't have to. Your browser sends language preferences, doesn't it? Nope, IP trumps user preferences. Had the same problem when using my job's VPN with an exit point in Germany (working from France). Very annoying.

>Your browser sends language preferences, doesn't it?

Since http1.0[0]... I have wanted to add another header -> "RespectAlHeaders:All-Custom-CrRafted", so the wimpy implementation of ip->country->language is duly removed.

[0]: https://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc1945.txt

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#373

Post by delfinom »

lbriner wrote: post #271
rsync wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"As a business owner, I'm continuously having to do things so I don't end up in spam. Less images, specific wording and the list goes on." We[1] run our own mail and DNS servers and, as you might imagine, have never sent a single HTML email or any email with any kind of "element" in it, etc. Just plain, ASCII text. We've got a 15 year clean IP, perfect score on the "mail config checkers" and almost every single email…

We have the same issue. Online surveys being sent as invites to 100s of 1000s of people per day and although we are good at spotting SPAMMERs setting up free accounts, obviously people will always receive an invite they might consider SPAM and we get derated. Persnally, we find Yahoo is the worst for blocking. It would be good to have a central registry of mail forwarders so that SPAM is not detected against register…

Unsolicited online surveys are always spam. I will always mark as spam with impunity.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#374

Post by baobabKoodaa »

ViViDboarder wrote: post #247
baobabKoodaa wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you would have actually read the link in the post you're replying to, you would know that Gmail is not accepting mail from me despite that I've spent a huge amount of time in verifying that everything is configured correctly. Also: please stop spreading unsubstantiated claims about your magical server magically sending mail past Gmail's spam filters. There's virtually no chance of that being true, and if it someho…

I run a personal mail server for just myself and I’ve been getting full delivery to Gmail so far as well. Same with Outlook. I’m waiting for the day they try to shut me down.

Can you show any evidence for these claims?

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#375

Post by baobabKoodaa »

perennate wrote: post #224
baobabKoodaa wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you would have actually read the link in the post you're replying to, you would know that Gmail is not accepting mail from me despite that I've spent a huge amount of time in verifying that everything is configured correctly. Also: please stop spreading unsubstantiated claims about your magical server magically sending mail past Gmail's spam filters. There's virtually no chance of that being true, and if it someho…

> Also: please stop spreading unsubstantiated claims about your magical server magically sending mail past Gmail's spam filters. There's virtually no chance of that being true, and if it somehow was true, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I'm sure most people who run low-volume mail servers here have no problems sending to Gmail. I don't know why you think this is an extraordinary claim -- I can un…

> I'm sure most people who run low-volume mail servers here have no problems sending to Gmail. I don't know why you think this is an extraordinary claim

Where are all these magical people with these magical abilities? How curious that not a single one of them is able to post any kind of evidence to support these incredulous claims. And funny how my comments on HN are getting downvoted and hidden when I ask for proof.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#376

Post by baobabKoodaa »

vcanales wrote: post #233
Avamander wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My low volume server can send mail very nicely. You can't however do your job half-assed, lack of strong SPF/TLS/DKIM isn't okay from both Google's and anti-spam perspective.

Same here. I also installed https://mailinabox.email on a server and can send email to gmail recipients without trouble. I had some trouble with one of my domains a couple of years ago but it was only related to misconfiguration on my side.

Can you show proof for these claims?

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#377

Post by baobabKoodaa »

ViViDboarder wrote: post #247
baobabKoodaa wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you would have actually read the link in the post you're replying to, you would know that Gmail is not accepting mail from me despite that I've spent a huge amount of time in verifying that everything is configured correctly. Also: please stop spreading unsubstantiated claims about your magical server magically sending mail past Gmail's spam filters. There's virtually no chance of that being true, and if it someho…

I run a personal mail server for just myself and I’ve been getting full delivery to Gmail so far as well. Same with Outlook. I’m waiting for the day they try to shut me down.

I don't believe you. Can you show proof?

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#378

Post by baobabKoodaa »

huhtenberg wrote: post #306
driverdan wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is new. Many email providers will throttle / blackhole you if they decide you're sending too fast or see too many bounces. Slow down your send rate, make sure your server is configured correctly, and prune your lists.

"Many providers" - any concrete examples? For an SPF/DKIM'd server that's been at the same IP for nearly a decade and had not a single spamming incident. PS. The list is immaculately maintained, the server is configured as properly as it gets and very conservatively rate-throttled. There's nothing obvious.

Gmail also occasionally blackholes mail.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#379

Post by baobabKoodaa »

Avamander wrote: post #275
baobabKoodaa wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you would have actually read the link in the post you're replying to, you would know that Gmail is not accepting mail from me despite that I've spent a huge amount of time in verifying that everything is configured correctly. Also: please stop spreading unsubstantiated claims about your magical server magically sending mail past Gmail's spam filters. There's virtually no chance of that being true, and if it someho…

I don't think it's magic, but okay, I don't have a reasonable way without doxing myself to have you test it out yourself.

There's plenty of low effort ways you could provide proof while maintaining relative anonymity (if you actually wanted to support your claims with evidence). For example, you can run a GlockApps test (5 minutes, free) and then take a screenshot of the results with identifying information blanked out.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#380

Post by massaman_yams »

rsync wrote: post #241
irjustin wrote: post #79

I would argue in this narrow case - I would not point to nefarious undercurrents. Google's ML mail spam models are that way because there's too many bad actors. Email, even in 2019, still extremely valuable. If you can get into people's email inbox, there's still quite high conversion rate - better than clicks/videos on a pure percentage basis. Even the author wants to reach out to people in a cold fashion. As a gmai…

"As a business owner, I'm continuously having to do things so I don't end up in spam. Less images, specific wording and the list goes on." We[1] run our own mail and DNS servers and, as you might imagine, have never sent a single HTML email or any email with any kind of "element" in it, etc. Just plain, ASCII text. We've got a 15 year clean IP, perfect score on the "mail config checkers" and almost every single email…

Sending text-only is probably a weak spam signal as far as Gmail is concerned; for the majority of mail to the majority of recipients (though yours may be exceptions), HTML email - even if very basic - offers better layout/design options and better readability.

On top of that, of very old-school users on Mutt or Pine who prefer text over HTML, I'd think a significant portion of them don't have their mail pass through Gmail's filters.

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