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Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

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Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#161

Post by astine »

manifestsilence wrote: post #114
throw1234651234 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"a term for a grammatical subclass to join sex in referring to either of the two primary biological forms of a species" Don't try to rewrite grammar to fit trends. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/gender

It's not a trend, it's an increase in scientific understanding. Language is fluid, or we would all be speaking some variant of old German on this forum (try reading Beowulf in the original). It's not grammar, it's semantics. Words are social. When one person tries to rewrite the meaning of a word, unless they have significant social clout they are just going to be misunderstood. When many people rewrite the meaning o…

The problem with this argument is that you are using descriptivist reasoning ("Language is fluid", "Words are social.") to support a prescriptivist conclusion ("There's no such thing as a 'biological gender.'") If historically 'gender' and 'sex' were mostly synonymous but recently people have decided to use the words differently then that's fine, but it doesn't make it wrong for people to still use the words the old way.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#162

Post by rpmisms »

dahart wrote: post #105
rpmisms wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Besides the concepts of motherhood and fatherhood. Ignoring those glaring omissions, you're closer to having a point.

The parent is completely correct, why are you fighting it? This isn’t something you can out-logic, the words have definitions. Sex is the biological part and gender is the social & cultural aspects of sex.

According to Merriam-Webster, gender /includes/ the social & cultural aspects of sex. The exclusion of sex from gender is an extremely recent development that isn't widely accepted yet.

Also, motherhood and fatherhood are biologically gender-linked roles. They are measurable biological phenomena that tie strongly into your definition of gender.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#163

Post by reroute1 »

magduf wrote: post #133
psv1 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, (since we're speculating) from an evolutionary perspective it's advantageous for men to have positive view of and attraction to as many women as possible, while at the same time it's advantageous for women to be as sceptical and critical of men as possible.

>while at the same time it's advantageous for women to be as sceptical and critical of men as possible. I don't know about this. These days, I've seen and met many women who have numerous male friends. Sure, ultra-conservative and religious women don't, but lots of women aren't conservative any more.

He's talking about evolution though, and it definitely seems to hold up for our past as a species.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#164

Post by NotAnEconomist »

jevgeni wrote: post #55
leeoniya wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

not science until it can be reproduced. and since this is a psychological study...

By that logic, for example, math and some quantum physics are not science. This distinction is useless.

That's.... true?

Math isn't a science, and some quantum physics is regularly chided for being more philosophy than science, because it doesn't make testable predictions.

The distinction seems useful.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#165

Post by klyrs »

elicash wrote: post #142

Is this true for same-sex couples, too? (Meaning, for example, that two gay men will on average have more positive attitudes towards ex-partners than two women, on average?)

Anecdotes: https://www.vice.com/en_ca/article/zngjgw/lesbians-friends-e...

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#166

Post by reroute1 »

k__ wrote: post #143
dsfyu404ed wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>What I wanted to say is, after what I heared from my partners about men they dated, I totally understand these results. Ex-partners are not exactly a reliable source of "the whole truth" even before we consider the content of the article. Edit: current partners are probably not the best source either, ask your local marriage counselor if you don't believe me.

True. Thing is, they already talk about these men before they are exes. I get the whole story, from first meeting to breakup.

Getting one side of the story is not getting the whole story.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#167

Post by dtwest »

Spooky23 wrote: post #139
malvosenior wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems to me the negative consequences are about the same for men and women. Lots of women speak poorly of their exes and get their friend groups turned against them...

I mentioned to a group of friends that I had run into a female acquinatance from 20+ years ago, who is now a judge. The reaction: "Lol. She was quite the party girl." Not the reaction that you'd get re: a dude.

Idk, I'd say the same about a party dude turned judge.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#168

Post by longtom »

dahart wrote: post #147
hacknat wrote: post #60

Social Psychology has one of the worst reproducibility problems in all of academia. Claims like this make is easy to see why. Simple scientific inquiry into this claim leads me to the question, “Okay, but why? That women potentially harbor worse feelings of their ex partners on average than men is one of the most interesting but useless things I’ve heard. The confounding explanations for this type of research are min…

> The confounding explanations for this type of research are mind boggling. Yes! This is very true, your questions are good questions to ask of any study of genders & attitudes. It’s even more important to ask of studies that try to factor out cultural issues, because confounding explanations are extremely difficult to remove. > Social Psychology has one of the worst reproducibility problems in all of academia. This…

> we’d love to know why, but we don’t truly know why yet

This isn't much of a mystery. It is simply easier to control for external factors in physics, making it easier to isolate the causal links of interest. In the social sciences, you have layers upon layers of biological, psychological and then cultural complexities. Secondly, physicists have higher IQ as greater economic incentives attract brighter people. Lastly, physics cannot be abused politically as easily.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#169

Post by shantly »

tomschlick wrote: post #152
shantly wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To support your point: I've seen products avoid using "sex" on a form in favor of "gender", when what they mean is "sex". Like, the difference was brought up in meetings, and they just didn't want to have the word "sex" appear in their program because it seemed more immediately eye-catching and distracting (and they're probably kinda right).

To be fair, until recently almost everyone considered gender to be a synonym for sex. Now people are taking "gender identity" and shortening it to be gender and taking exception to people using the synonym as we always have.

I saw the shift to "gender" as the social side of sex way before I ever heard or read the term "gender identity". Though maybe that is what happened and "gender identity" was just very, very niche at the time (like, 25 years ago, probably) such that its descendent term "gender" outran it, so to speak. However, I got the impression that the distinction between "gender" and "sex" predated my encounter of it by decades.

Webster's 1913 does appear to regard "gender" as exclusively a grammatical quality, so far as definitions related to this topic go. So the modern usage may not be quite that old.

[EDIT] huh, whaddaya know, Garner's Modern English Usage puts the move to "gender" in places where "sex" would previously have been used (to refer to all or to any part of the whole deal, not just the biological bits) as right around when I first encountered it, at least outside an initially-narrow set of academic disciplines. Go figure. It is newer than I thought, by a long shot. I figured it dated to the 60s or so in academia, mainstream by the 80s and I just hadn't encountered anyone who cared to make the distinction until later.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#170

Post by jgalt212 »

ebiester wrote: post #90
jgalt212 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Biological explanation You can't study that these days. The orthodoxy insists that any differences in outcomes are solely due to environment, power structures, implicit and explicit biases.

Perhaps that is because we can identify the implicit and explicit biases, power structures, and environmental issues that are in front of our faces, and that there are more differences that can be explained by them than by biological causes.

Yes, I hear you on this. It's the old nature vs nurture debate. And the leftist orthodoxy is against any theory, finding or research that would assign some non-trivial level of blame to nature. My beef is that the left, who like consider them pro-science, can at times be just as anti-science as the right.
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