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A History of Pizza

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Re: A History of Pizza

#31

Post by dotancohen »

greggman2 wrote: post #21
lordnacho wrote: post #19

The abomination created by putting pineapple on pizza is either Canadian or German: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaiian_pizza Dig a bit more and it seems the German claim is a bit stronger. The postwar years were difficult in Europe.

I'm pretty sure tuna and corn on pizza is a German thing too.

It should be noted that the original idea for pizza is that anything available would be thrown on top. So the Germans may have popularized the tuna and corn, but in effect the original pizzas would have had those thrown on if they had been common in Naples at the time.

Re: A History of Pizza

#32

Post by zeitg3ist »

manojlds wrote: post #18
SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many varieties of Italian pizza are "white pizza" / "pizza blanca" and have no tomatoes.

Like pesto ones too right.

As an Italian (not from Genoa though), pesto to me has always been just a pasta sauce, so I was very surprised to see it used on salads and pizzas abroad. But recently (in the last 2-3 years) I’ve seen quite a few Italian pizzerias (not the most traditional, of course) starting to use it as an alternative choice to the tomato sauce, or, sometimes, in place of the olive oil on top. Not sure if it’s a regional variation gone national or an influence from abroad... but if it’s the latter, no Italian would ever admit that :)

Re: A History of Pizza

#34

Post by ReptileMan »

zeitg3ist wrote: post #26
ReptileMan wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have eaten those style of pizza. They are tasty. Not everything must be Neapolitan to be edible. I think it may depends on local ingredients - since Italy has amazing ones it is just a matter of putting simple toppings with minimal heat processing not to fuck them up and serve. If there were no good local substitutes you have to pump up the grease and toast the ingredients a bit more to make it flavorful enough.

Oh I know it can be tasty, I have eaten my fair share of greasy pizzas too. And I’m not saying neapolitan is the only possible pizza style, although in my opinion it’s the best one. Neapolitan is actually charred on the crust too, but it’s not that extreme - the crust from the pizza above is basically coal... Don’t get me wrong, I would eat it anyway (maybe skipping the crust), but it definitely doesn’t look like a “…

PDO and PDI help a lot when it comes to providing excellent and consistent ingredients.

You could grow anything in the US and there are indeed great producers for everything. The problem is recognition.

PDO/DOP Parmigiano, prosciutto and olive oil and san marazano tomatoes are in the you cannot do wrong cathegory. They are always excellent.

A pizza maker in the US will have a lot harder time discovering great ingredients made in US. Not because they don't exist, but because anyone can label almost anything.

Re: A History of Pizza

#35

Post by benj111 »

potatofarmer45 wrote: post #3

"Some even had tomatoes on top. Only recently introduced from the Americas, these were still a curiosity, looked down upon by contemporary gourmets". Well that settles it. Next time a pizza traditionalist blasts me for having pineapple on my pizza, I'll counter that he shouldn't have tomatoes on theirs.

When you say "pizza traditionalist" you seem to mean 'someone with functioning tastebuds'.

:)

Re: A History of Pizza

#36

Post by dagw »

lordnacho wrote: post #19

The abomination created by putting pineapple on pizza is either Canadian or German: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaiian_pizza Dig a bit more and it seems the German claim is a bit stronger. The postwar years were difficult in Europe.

Living in Sweden, I can assure you that pineapple doesn't even come close to making the top-10 of abominable things you can put on a "pizza"

Re: A History of Pizza

#37

Post by ryanlol »

benj111 wrote: post #35
potatofarmer45 wrote: post #3

"Some even had tomatoes on top. Only recently introduced from the Americas, these were still a curiosity, looked down upon by contemporary gourmets". Well that settles it. Next time a pizza traditionalist blasts me for having pineapple on my pizza, I'll counter that he shouldn't have tomatoes on theirs.

When you say "pizza traditionalist" you seem to mean 'someone with functioning tastebuds'. :)

Why is it always pineapple in pizza? Why not lemon for example?

I don’t understand the whole pineapple pizza lobby, it’s just not a particularly good fruit for pizza.

Re: A History of Pizza

#38

Post by MisterTea »

arethuza wrote: post #10
dr_dshiv wrote: post #8

Boo, no mention of New Haven's early contribution. Not that I'm biased (I am, they have the best pizza in the world, objectively speaking, of course) http://www.ctvisit.com/articles/new-haven-apizza-history

I can think of a few contenders for best pizza that I have had (mostly in Italy) - but the worst was undoubtedly a ghastly slice of horror that I purchased at the big conference centre in Atlanta - the pizza topping had been burnt and this was remedied by heaping on more cheese and mystery meat to obscure this fact.

> but the worst was undoubtedly a ghastly slice of horror that I purchased at the big conference centre in Atlanta

Well duh. It's conference center food. Might as well complain how the worst hamburger you had was at a McDonalds in Portland.

Re: A History of Pizza

#39

Post by crispyambulance »

oarsinsync wrote: post #29
zeitg3ist wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh I know it can be tasty, I have eaten my fair share of greasy pizzas too. And I’m not saying neapolitan is the only possible pizza style, although in my opinion it’s the best one. Neapolitan is actually charred on the crust too, but it’s not that extreme - the crust from the pizza above is basically coal... Don’t get me wrong, I would eat it anyway (maybe skipping the crust), but it definitely doesn’t look like a “…

> I imagine you can grow pretty much anything in the US at a decent quality I believe this is true, subject to the original source material (seeds?) being imported. > but with its size, population and diversity of climates This makes it tricky, as producing enough of the high quality ingredients in appropriate locations, that can survive the transportation distances, creates a whole new range of problems. Solving thi…

> Solving this at Italy scale is a different matter to solving this at USA scale.

Italian cuisine is all about letting the ingredients speak for themselves and success really depends on having high quality ingredients. So, yes, selecting for tomatoes that have long shelf life and trucking them long distances would violate Italian food sensibilities.

The Italian point of view would be to make the most of the ingredients that are available where you are. In other words, if you don't have fresh tasty tomatoes in the middle of winter, don't substitute subpar global-supply-chain tomatoes from the supermarket. Instead, use something else, like high-quality sundried tomatoes or don't use tomatoes at all. This is what happens in Italy, and it's why what visiting Americans might consider "iconic" Italian dishes aren't always present or recognizable.

Re: A History of Pizza

#40

Post by C1sc0cat »

ryanlol wrote: post #37
benj111 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you say "pizza traditionalist" you seem to mean 'someone with functioning tastebuds'. :)

Why is it always pineapple in pizza? Why not lemon for example? I don’t understand the whole pineapple pizza lobby, it’s just not a particularly good fruit for pizza.

The contrasting taste of Pineapple and Ham does work well in my opinion.
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