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Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

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Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#101

Post by sremani »

throwaway2048 wrote: post #83
lucasverra wrote: post #55

David Marcus update [1] : Special thanks to @Visa and @Mastercard for sticking it out until the 11th hour. The pressure has been intense (understatement), and I respect their decision to wait until there’s regulatory clarity for @Libra_ to proceed, vs. the invoked threats (by many) on their biz. I would caution against reading the fate of Libra into this update. Of course, it’s not great news in the short term, but i…

This is good for libra(coin)?

He is re-framing it to "when the times get tough the tough get going" mode. Its also a signal, that they are going to move forward what ever that is.

Good or Bad, its hard to tell for the project but at least you are left with the feeling that Libra team is formidable and preparing to weather the storm.

If I have to guess, something is going to come out it from this project, either a policy clarity from governments or while tinkering Libra team may pivot into some useful use case etc.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#102

Post by capableweb »

lacker wrote: post #99
capableweb wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Traditional banking replaced by company focused on good technology, sure, that sounds good. That's not what Libra aim(ed) for though. Libra was designed as a currency to take over the world, replacing the rest. You do not want a for-profit company to run a global currency. Sure, let them run banks, one bank won't rule the world. But the one who holds all the money, will.

I do want a for-profit company to run a global currency. I would rather there be hundreds of global currencies, with me free to choose which one I would rather use, if any.

If a for-profit company is running the currency, the users of the currency are in a loosing position. Remember, the for-profit company wants profit, so good luck fighting with them about the currency.

"hundreds of global currencies" sounds like a good idea to me too, as long as they are out of the hands of for-profit companies.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#103

Post by southerndrift »

jtms wrote: post #65

There was absolutely no reason for this to project to exist. The only feature of digital currencies that make some of them interesting is that they are fully distributed and based on absolutely zero trust of other users on the network. What Facebook was trying to do here was take something that could be implemented in a standard centralized database, stick some marketing on it, and try to ride a hype wave that has si…

How else can facebook prevent people from moving on to wechat with its internal payment system? Why should people stick to facebook if wechat can offer a whole bunch of services that need (micro) transactions?

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#104

Post by notahacker »

jeremyjh wrote: post #51
Barrin92 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>no one anticipated the reaction from lawmakers and rules agencies. if that's really the case at the Facebook headquarters they need to do some soul searching about how in touch they are with the world at large. Because when I read that the biggest social network on the planet is going to try to introduce its own currency it took me and I think a lot of other people exactly two seconds to figure out that Uncle Sam an…

Why would Visa, Mastercard and others agree to participate if they believed it was doomed in this way? I do not think it was nearly so obvious as you suggest. The way rules agencies had treated crypto so far looked accommodating.

When you're at Visa and Mastercard scale you can happily spend the relatively tiny amount of money and man hours on something you're 99.9% sure isn't an existential threat to your business, just to have that warning and that hedge... and that ability to propose that Libra follows exactly the same expensive compliance processes they do to guarantee it doesn't have an edge on transaction costs.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#105

Post by kebman »

throwaway2048 wrote: post #83
lucasverra wrote: post #55

David Marcus update [1] : Special thanks to @Visa and @Mastercard for sticking it out until the 11th hour. The pressure has been intense (understatement), and I respect their decision to wait until there’s regulatory clarity for @Libra_ to proceed, vs. the invoked threats (by many) on their biz. I would caution against reading the fate of Libra into this update. Of course, it’s not great news in the short term, but i…

This is good for libra(coin)?

Well, I don't know about that, but it's certainly good for the world. :)

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#106

Post by FillardMillmore »

notahacker wrote: post #94
capableweb wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Simply hunt down vendors who accept Bitcoin and organizations who facilitate its exchange. This is commonly a argument for having drugs illegal too. "If we hunt them down, eventually there will be no one left" What we know now, is that making something illegal, could make it stronger. If Bitcoin becomes illegal in most country, would the price go up or down? Suddenly there is a black market, and opens up a whole ot…

There's a black market for drugs because people like taking drugs. On the other hand, people only like receiving cryptographic tokens on the assumption that they will be able to exchange them for something in future, something considerably less likely if giving away products and services for alphanumeric strings is illegal... and unlike drugs, the supply of cryptoassets doesn't shrink when the government makes them m…

> There's a black market for drugs because people like taking drugs.

Perhaps this is somewhat pedantic, but I think it's more accurate to say that there's a black market for drugs because governments have passed laws to make certain drugs illegal and some groups of people have accepted the risks that come with supplying the demand for this particular market in order to make a profit.

> On the other hand, people only like receiving cryptographic tokens on the assumption that they will be able to exchange them for something in future

It may not be exactly this simple, although this is mostly true. There are those out there that purchase cryptocurrencies to make foreign financial transactions in a way that may be considerably more difficult with their country's accepted currency. This doesn't necessarily have to be an exchange, it could simply be sending said cryptocurrency to a wallet of a relative in a foreign country.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#107

Post by kebman »

jeremyjh wrote: post #31

It looks like a misstep followed by a hasty and ignominious retreat because thats exactly what happened - no one anticipated the reaction from lawmakers and rules agencies. Its kind of hard to see this from the perspective of people who follow tech and HN, but Libra really may have been the first occasion that the possibility of crypto as anything other than an investment instrument - e.g. an actual usage as currency…

I think your view is very interesting. How does one go about destroying a threat to the current currency system?

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#108

Post by FillardMillmore »

mamon wrote: post #63
pat87 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin can be killed by means other than technological. For example it can be outlawed. Sure, people would still be able to use it, but they would be breaking the law and that would deter many, possibly enough to kill it outright.

Bitcoin does not need to be killed because it’s dead already: proved to be useless for all practical purposes, now used mostly for money laundering or other criminal activities

This is a bold claim - proven to be useless for all practical purposes by whom? Care to provide evidence to back this up?

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#109

Post by Nydhal »

southerndrift wrote: post #103
jtms wrote: post #65

There was absolutely no reason for this to project to exist. The only feature of digital currencies that make some of them interesting is that they are fully distributed and based on absolutely zero trust of other users on the network. What Facebook was trying to do here was take something that could be implemented in a standard centralized database, stick some marketing on it, and try to ride a hype wave that has si…

How else can facebook prevent people from moving on to wechat with its internal payment system? Why should people stick to facebook if wechat can offer a whole bunch of services that need (micro) transactions?

China

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#110

Post by SkyMarshal »

xabotage wrote: post #89
CodiePetersen wrote: post #54

I'm actually glad it's dead/dying. It was always going to be controlled by an elite group who answered to no one but themselves. They had the ability to monitor all of your transactions and if they didn't like you they could roll back or block your transactions. People keep saying oh this is proof crypto can't ever work because government. This was never a true crypto currency. It was just a private ledger tracking w…

>They had the ability to monitor all of your transactions and if they didn't like you they could roll back or block your transactions. Unlike, what, my established credit card company which still blocks me randomly when I'm traveling overseas even when I explicitly call their 800 hotline, sit on hold for 30 minutes, and tell some unempathetic worker "I'm overseas, don't block me"? Yes, thank goodness libra is dying,…

>Unlike, what, my established credit card company which still blocks me randomly when I'm traveling overseas even when I explicitly call their 800 hotline, sit on hold for 30 minutes, and tell some unempathetic worker "I'm overseas, don't block me"? Yes, thank goodness libra is dying, otherwise there might actually be some innovation against the exact things you just mentioned which perfectly describe the current state of affairs.

You should just get a new credit card or bank, whatever you're using is really out of date. Most modern cards and banks have websites or phone apps you can submit a travel notice on. Takes all of 2m and prevents you getting blocked for charges in that country.

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