Fallout from Blizzard Hong Kong Incident • Hacker News Board

Re: Fallout from Blizzard Hong Kong Incident

#41

Post by busterarm » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:21 PM UTC

Knufen wrote: post #5

It is scary to see how much more China and the CCP can get away with, I'm looking forward to seeing where it will all end up. Probably not in a good place. Money talks, morals? Not so much.

I think long-term it's maybe okay. All of this is a sign that the CCP is losing control of things. Of course their reaction is to tighten up and things are going to get worse before they get better.

Unfortunately I do think this means we're going to see some action in the South China Sea region. China has problems to deal with in Hong Kong, Taiwan, North Korea, Xinjiang, Tibet, etc. Eventually one of its neighbors is going to get aspirations and will poke the bear. Hopefully China is spread too-thin to deal with it, although that will mean conflict. Violence will be necessary here.

Re: Fallout from Blizzard Hong Kong Incident

#42

Post by baseballdork » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:21 PM UTC

dheera wrote: post #24

School-Cotton wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no law or constitutional provision in the US that says you can’t refuse to work with someone for their political views.

It's kind of unfortunate. It's like there's free speech, but the reality is almost everyone needs to work to live, and by way of working, their freedom of speech is effectively revoked. EEOC makes it illegal to discriminate based on race, color, religion, sex, national origin; why can't political views and speech said outside of the workplace be a part of that?

Do you consider nazism a political view?

Re: Fallout from Blizzard Hong Kong Incident

#43

Post by School-Cotton » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:22 PM UTC

montagg wrote: post #31

gruez wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's legal to discriminate as long as it's not a protected class.

There are some states, like CA, where discrimination based on political views is illegal, but it’s practically-speaking not too hard for an employer to find a more traditional performance reason that may be related to political views. Caveat: IANAL Source: https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/can-employers-discri...

Even then, that refers to employees specifically, and the person in question is probably not a Blizzard employees.

Re: Fallout from Blizzard Hong Kong Incident

#44

Post by BrandonMarc » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:22 PM UTC

dekhn wrote: post #33

Knufen wrote: post #5

It is scary to see how much more China and the CCP can get away with, I'm looking forward to seeing where it will all end up. Probably not in a good place. Money talks, morals? Not so much.

Right now the leadership in China is terrified! They've been able to get away with a lot, basically using their economic power to get other countries to look the other way with regards to their behavior (suppressing their people, stealing IP, bullying smaller nations). but the moment they got called on it and people started moving their operations to other countries (previously considered "impossible"), they saw the…

Indeed. The "decoupling" phenomenon has their attention.

Re: Fallout from Blizzard Hong Kong Incident

#45

Post by _bxg1 » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:22 PM UTC

rossdavidh wrote: post #28

And yet, I see absolutely no talk, even from the U.S. Senators who are quoted, of the U.S. actually doing anything about it that would make a difference.

To be honest, for once the market seems to be doing a pretty good job.

Re: Fallout from Blizzard Hong Kong Incident

#46

Post by michannne » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:23 PM UTC

john_moscow wrote: post #21

MBCook wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you give an example of free speech being quieted? We push political issues that way, but I’m not aware of censorship being the trigger.

The most well-known one would be James Damore being fired from Google for criticizing the corporate diversity policies [0]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google%27s_Ideological_Echo_Ch...

While I agree that Damore's termination was an attempt to punish him for the views he had, I wouldn't put it anywhere in the same class as we are seeing with Chinese censorship. This is an entire country, a state government, deciding what people of other countries should be allowed to say, it is on par with Muslim views on comedic interpretations of Mohammed, and is likely to entice violence in much the same way.

Re: Fallout from Blizzard Hong Kong Incident

#47

Post by Svoka » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:23 PM UTC

coralreef wrote: post #6

Propose that a suspended player is a US citizen. This feels unconstitutional / illegal, as Blizzard has taken away the player's ability to earn a living based in their political views. The guise of suspension under the violation of "disparagement" feels weak. I'd be interested in seeing how a lawsuit plays out.

Unconstitutional? Like, did you try to read first amendment? Here it is:

> Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

So, did Congress of the USA have to do anything about it? No, "free speech" does not mean you can say anything you want without facing consequences from people who hired you or your friends. Blizzard hired player to play in tournament, and they can fire him if they want. There is nothing illegal in Blizzard's actions.

Morally, though...

Re: Fallout from Blizzard Hong Kong Incident

#48

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:24 PM UTC

[deleted]

Re: Fallout from Blizzard Hong Kong Incident

#49

Post by f-securus » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:24 PM UTC

Analemma_ wrote: post #13

yellow_lead wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Noticing this a lot more recently with the NBA controversy too.

The NBA at least seems to be walking back their initial condemnation of Morey's comments, China be damned: [0]. We should give them credit for that. Conversely, there's been radio silence from Blizzard so far. [0]: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/08/sports/adam-silver-nba-ch...

But they ejected fans that had HK posters?

Re: Fallout from Blizzard Hong Kong Incident

#50

Post by dak1 » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:24 PM UTC

The CCP can move quickly and decisively to ban access to the world's 2nd largest market, and it uses that power to chill speech and force governments and companies to take actions it wants that are antithetical to a free society.

Small nations and individual companies cannot stand up to this coercion individually, and free, market economies lack the organization to respond in a cohesive way.

The optimistic belief that economic growth and market integration would liberalize authoritarian or totalitarian countries should by now be wholly debunked.

The CCP is responsible for some of the most horrific atrocities and violations of human rights today, and has largely managed to silence the world from even speaking out against its actions.

Individuals should do everything they can to express their opposition to this state of affairs, but the only viable response is for the governments of free peoples who care for and value these freedoms to jointly act in response.

If we value freedom over money, there must be economic consequences (including economic isolation) for China for its actions, and we should not be reluctant about promoting these freedoms globally, including within China.

The GATT and WTO rules in place today are not sufficient to counter the threat China represents. It's time to rewrite the rules of global trade to prevent the CCP from freely benefiting from trade while simultaneously using it as a hammer to blunt and distort the values that enabled the markets from which it benefits.