'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology • Hacker News Board

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#81

Post by jplayer01 » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 2:01 PM UTC

ghostcluster wrote: post #23

diveanon wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I truly doubt they would cave to any pressure at all. Those two thrive on this kind of controversy, I can basically picture them sitting back and rubbing their nipples while watching this unfold. We need more people like Trey Parker and Matt Stone who aren't afraid of starting some controversy to get a conversation started. They choose to do it through cartoons and satire, but I honestly believe they understand our s…

You have to give some credit to Viacom, the media company, for allowing the show to air. Viacom owns Comedy Central, MTV, Paramount Pictures, DreamWorks, and CBS among other media properties. They certainly have business interests in China.

I'm waiting to see if the other shoe will drop or not. The latest numbers about Viacom's revenue by country that I can find are from 2014, where the US and Europe account for 90% of their revenue (https://csimarket.com/stocks/segments_geo.php?code=VIA). Seeing as how Viacom was trying to sell its majority stake in their TV businesses in China earlier this year, maybe they just won't care about blowback from China.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#82

Post by dekhn » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 2:04 PM UTC

Konnstann wrote: post #75

dekhn wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand where you're coming from and I thought twice about using that word. I certainly appreciate the work done to give me freedoms, and I agree luck had a big part of it. But the reality is that as a white middle class male in the US, I do have the privilege to say things and do things in public that people who aren't white or middle class can't. The freedoms we have aren't equally distributed due to systemic…

Can you give me an example of something a non-white, non-middle class person can't say or do in public? Maybe it's my limited world-view, but I can't think of anything specific.

Sure, if you (10 years ago) smoked a joint on the street, and you were black, you carried a far far higher risk of being imprisoned.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#83

Post by zarro » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 2:05 PM UTC

Before this episode I always wondered why they kept making those bad transformers movies, turns out China loves em.

I think its fine if people want to make movies for the China market, but what I find alarming is copycat behavior trying to bring that sort of censorship here.

It doesn't make any sense to me why anyone should apologize or censor themselves creatively just because someone got salty about it. I find the notion limiting someones creative expression to someone else's judgement of "appropriate" to be despicably egregious.

Sure you can vote with your dollar and time by not watching something you don't like, but its the creators prerogative what to create and what not to create.

Anyone arguing the contrary on the effects of censorship has not looked into the origin of the word.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#84

Post by dekhn » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 2:07 PM UTC

jaynetics wrote: post #73

dTal wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they weren't, how on Earth would you know? Being anything other than publicly "overwhelmingly supportive of the government" gets you killed. I believe many Chinese citizens are aware that their situation is not ideal ("oppressed" is probably not quite the right word), because I believe at least some subset of Chinese citizens are not brainwashed morons and any idiot can see what's going on. If they really had over…

> any idiot can see what's going on Yes? Would you want to try circumventing the great firewall without getting caught? I fear the Chinese are mostly supportive. Most Germans also supported Hitler before things went awry, and his election results were superb even before massive manipulation began. There was still a substantial minority that didn't support him and resisted at great personal cost, much like some educat…

Don't large numbers of professional chinese who work on the internet use VPNs to get around the firewall?

My insight into this comes mainly from professional Chinese scientists who were previously trained in the US but returned to China because there were better scientific opportunities. Many of them have told me (in person, while visitng the US) that they have to use VPNs to get their work done, and as long as they are relatively cautious, circumspect, and don't repeat what they see to others, they are tolerated.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#85

Post by rwj » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 2:08 PM UTC

olalonde wrote: post #54

bluntfang wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>One wonders if there is an entire revolutionary class within China sharing South Park videos for freedom. I've noticed a trend on this site in particular where we collectively wonder if our western media is a part of Chinese counter-culture. Is this hubris uniquely American?

That and the idea that Chinese citizens see themselves as oppressed. As crazy as it may seem to us, they're overwhelmingly supportive of their government.

And how was that measured?

One of the lessons from the falls of authoritarian governments was how big a gap there was between public expressions of support and peoples' true feelings.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#86

Post by chc4 » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 2:08 PM UTC

zarro wrote: post #83

Before this episode I always wondered why they kept making those bad transformers movies, turns out China loves em. I think its fine if people want to make movies for the China market, but what I find alarming is copycat behavior trying to bring that sort of censorship here. It doesn't make any sense to me why anyone should apologize or censor themselves creatively just because someone got salty about it. I find the…

>Before this episode I always wondered why they kept making those bad transformers movies, turns out China loves em.

...Which is hilarious, because they are heavily subsidized by the US military for advertising reasons.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#87

Post by eli_gottlieb » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 2:10 PM UTC

dekhn wrote: post #71

StaticRedux wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not privilege. It's a right the country has fought and died for for over 200 years. It's a principle the country was founded on. "Privilege" has lost all meaning in today's world. It's just a word to throw around to slow how "woke" you are. Calling our rights "privilege" is throwing out the struggle and sacrifice of everyone that fought for those rights. You may have been Lucky to have been born in the US, but n…

I understand where you're coming from and I thought twice about using that word. I certainly appreciate the work done to give me freedoms, and I agree luck had a big part of it. But the reality is that as a white middle class male in the US, I do have the privilege to say things and do things in public that people who aren't white or middle class can't. The freedoms we have aren't equally distributed due to systemic…

Yes, but there's still a pretty hard distinction between material privileges and actual constitutional rights. For instance, we don't criticize racialized police brutality because it's some maldistribution of police attention, but because it violates rights that are supposed to be inviolate.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#88

Post by eli_gottlieb » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 2:11 PM UTC

corodra wrote: post #52

throwaway_bad wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes we forget that getting disappeared in china is not just a meme. Police will show up to arrest you just for posting comments online: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCOAbkTs_a4

Well, lets not forget their detention camps for ethnic minorities they don't like: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/23/china-footage-... I mean at this rate, I seriously think in a decade or two, we're going to find a Holocaust level event has been going on in China that's going to make the Nazis look like amateurs. But instead, we're focused on stupid left/right political differences and figuring out wheth…

Putting ethnic minorities in concentration camps is an early-Holocaust atrocity today.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#89

Post by gonational » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 2:12 PM UTC

grievances wrote: post #78

StaticRedux wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not privilege. It's a right the country has fought and died for for over 200 years. It's a principle the country was founded on. "Privilege" has lost all meaning in today's world. It's just a word to throw around to slow how "woke" you are. Calling our rights "privilege" is throwing out the struggle and sacrifice of everyone that fought for those rights. You may have been Lucky to have been born in the US, but n…

Many brave people have fought and died for their countries and rights. Its easy to forget that minorities and “unlucky” people fight too; knowing that you’re safe expressing your points of view is something that many have earned, not all have received. That very much sounds like privilege to me.

We fight to make this country what it is so that we can all stand together as one people, not so we can whine like little babies about who’s more privileged or marginalized than everyone else.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#90

Post by corodra » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 2:12 PM UTC

senorjazz wrote: post #69

bluntfang wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>One wonders if there is an entire revolutionary class within China sharing South Park videos for freedom. I've noticed a trend on this site in particular where we collectively wonder if our western media is a part of Chinese counter-culture. Is this hubris uniquely American?

> Is this hubris uniquely American? Probably not, but evidence does point towards a general attitude of "surely everyone wants to be like us, we are the best country in the world afterall"

>"surely everyone wants to be like us, we are the best country in the world afterall"

To be fair, that's generated from many immigrants who come to the USA with the feeling that "this is the land of opportunities and freedom". Granted, when you come from somewhere like soviet occupied Poland, it doesn't really take much to find a land of opportunity and freedom. But other immigrants from other countries say the same.

If you're an American and a majority of your experience with foreigners are the people that come in saying that, and one of their proudest days is becoming an American citizen, you generally get an idea that America is a pretty good country. As a first gen, I don't see American's having pride in their country as fully unwarranted. It's not like other countries are without their fuck ups.