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Richard Stallman Has Been Vilified by Those Who Don’t Know Him

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Re: Richard Stallman Has Been Vilified by Those Who Don’t Know Him

#211

Post by throwaway877cf9 »

Pfhreak wrote: post #43

Dude has gone out of his way to make other people uncomfortable. I use singular they for my pronouns. He's so bothered by this that he goes out of his way to not only tell me I'm wrong for doing so, but to invent his own language for referring to folks who use gender neutral pronouns (which no one will understand, because it's not widely used). I would certainly question whether I was welcome at an event where he was…

This is the shit trans people get away with and you think your stupid fucking pronouns matter, get out of your bubble you privileged piece of shit https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/08/women-only-rape-relie...

Re: Richard Stallman Has Been Vilified by Those Who Don’t Know Him

#212

Post by api »

emiliobumachar wrote: post #195
api wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I question a fundamental assumption here: that Stallman was let go or pushed to resign because of "SJWs." I don't see much evidence of that. "SJWs" have had problems with him for years and nothing happened... until now. What's different this time? Stallman's comments on Epstein added to the embarrassment of MIT. He waded into a political bonfire and added fuel. The last thing MIT needs is someone affiliated with MIT…

Stallman did not defend Epstein in any way, shape, or form.

He minimized it.

What he intended to do doesn't matter. That's not my point. What matters is that his words could be interpreted that way and that he was affiliated with MIT.

Re: Richard Stallman Has Been Vilified by Those Who Don’t Know Him

#213

Post by ng12 »

Pfhreak wrote: post #105
marmada wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why his pronoun scheme is antagonistic. He still respects that you want gender neutral pronouns, he just won't use they because he thinks they has a standard plural meaning. I don't understand why people have an obligation to use "they" specifically as long as they respect the gender neutral concept.

> I don't understand why people have an obligation to use "they" specifically as long as they respect the gender neutral concept. The same reason we use people's names. Or their nicknames. Or their middle names sometimes. Or their stage names, noms de plume, or noms de guerre. When you are introduced to someone you expect to be spending some time around, you might ask them, "Do you prefer Henry or Hank? Charles or Ch…

> "I propose we use only people's full and legal names when referring to them, because I believe that system works better."

Undoubtedly a weird, outsider view of things but I wouldn't advocate him being punished for doing so. Nor would I advocate for shaming him for choosing to use people's full names in daily conversation.

Re: Richard Stallman Has Been Vilified by Those Who Don’t Know Him

#214

Post by lawnchair_larry »

zaroth wrote: post #82
flippinburgers wrote: post #67

If you read the article she notes that the infamous "hot ladies" photo was the result of someone else writing and then snapping that shot of his office door. People only see what they want to see. I see a bunch of people beating up on and attacking an awkward "nerd". It reminds me of high school.

But on Twitter all you see is this; https://twitter.com/sarahmei/status/1172283772428906496?s=21

Yikes, what an awful group of self-righteous people. Bullying and slander is perfectly fine when the virtuous do it I see.

Re: Richard Stallman Has Been Vilified by Those Who Don’t Know Him

#215

Post by lawnchair_larry »

tudelo wrote: post #173
zaroth wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But on Twitter all you see is this; https://twitter.com/sarahmei/status/1172283772428906496?s=21

That thread definitely has a lot of interesting information. Some things seem kind of off though... but in general it seems mostly fair.

There is nothing fair about it.

Re: Richard Stallman Has Been Vilified by Those Who Don’t Know Him

#216

Post by emiliobumachar »

lilyball wrote: post #143

> As an active feminist and one who has witnessed much bad behavior among tech CEOs over the past 30 years, I think that accusing Richard Stallman of not supporting women, gays, or any other minority group is false. Look at his real history — […] — but his record in helping to give everyone in the world access to free software. What kind of bullshit is this? Stallman's advocacy for open source in no way whatsoever ma…

She has reasonably solid feminist credentials, which she presented up front, probably to preempt accusations of sexism.

No True Scotsman would ever support Stallman?

Re: Richard Stallman Has Been Vilified by Those Who Don’t Know Him

#217

Post by ng12 »

lilyball wrote: post #143

> As an active feminist and one who has witnessed much bad behavior among tech CEOs over the past 30 years, I think that accusing Richard Stallman of not supporting women, gays, or any other minority group is false. Look at his real history — […] — but his record in helping to give everyone in the world access to free software. What kind of bullshit is this? Stallman's advocacy for open source in no way whatsoever ma…

That's a good question, how is it decided? Is there a tribunal?

Re: Richard Stallman Has Been Vilified by Those Who Don’t Know Him

#218

Post by ineedasername »

steveeq1 wrote: post #178
tkel wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, and often it comes from a place of skepticism, not from a place of trying to understand. And also from a place of laziness, where the skeptic expects the marginalized person to explain why the behavior or speech is harmful, and explain it in a way that is acceptable to the skeptic. All the while the understanding is a short Google search away.

The problem is it's selectively applied. I can just as easily argue that rap music as "harmful" and what they said were "terrible" things, and yet there is no public outrage over that. In western society, it seems, thugs are exempt from all the politically correct standards that the rest of us are expected to abide by.

Apart from rap just, really, really not at all being anywhere in the same ballpark, there are examples where rap music has undergone social scrutiny and changed as a result: Cop killing lyrics. I'm not saying they don't occur at all any more, but they're considered much less acceptable than in the 90's.

Re: Richard Stallman Has Been Vilified by Those Who Don’t Know Him

#219

Post by simplehuman »

fzeroracer wrote: post #205
simplehuman wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why isn't the harassing behavior being brought up through the right channels? Is internet rage the right way to do this?

Exactly what channels? The police? A lot of what RMS has done isn't illegal and generally there's a very high legal bar for harassment. So people eventually share their stories through social media and even that doesn't work sometimes (see: Riot). His behavior doesn't have to cross into illegality to be reprehensible.

For a start just leaving a paper trail of formal complaints at MIT would help ascertain this has been happenning for a long time. I just find it shocking that there is no formal complaint. Instead, what we have is just random people claiming that other people got harassed. None of this is verifiable and honestly if internet has thought us anything it is that everybody lies in social media just to get a few likes.

Re: Richard Stallman Has Been Vilified by Those Who Don’t Know Him

#220

Post by [deleted] »

roenxi wrote: post #150
favorited wrote: post #5

Here[0] is a post by someone else who (by his own account) "worked for RMS longer than any other programmer." While he obviously has had a long relationship with Stallman, one of his key takeaways was: "RMS’s loss of MIT privileges and leadership of the FSF are the appropriate responses to a pattern of decades of poor behavior. It does not matter if they are appropriate responses to a single email thread, because the…

Bushnell* writes a very reasonable piece. It deals with a number of issues with Stallman as a leader of the FSF and MIT and suggests Stallman is unlikely to come back to either of those institutions. But he doesn't deal with what the big problem here is - the way this was done is concerning. Stallman wasn't forced to resign by people like him - who are quite happy to say "Look, Stallman, you've dedicated your life to…

[deleted]
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