Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Why would I want to try to resolve my issues within this gendered framework? Am I really primarily male? That seems like a forced choice to me. It is a forced choice. The model of gender as a binary state rather than a spectrum is an obsolete and harmful social construct.
If it’s not a binary, it’s still a very much bimodal distribution. Ironically, the notion that gender is either a binary or a spectrum is a false dichotomy. It’s obviously a bimodal distribution with most, but not all, people clustered around one of the two peaks.
Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)
191–200 of 402 posts
Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)
#192Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's not how men process things. Men process things by trying to eliminate perceived unnecessary information and take action. Women are more inclined to want to sit down and discuss all the details of whatever is going on, many of those details the man would not perceive as useful. This is the age old men vs women problem where women feel like men don't want to talk about problems/feelings and men feel like women j…
> That's not how men process things. Men process things by trying to eliminate perceived unnecessary information and take action. Women are more inclined to want to sit down and discuss all the details of whatever is going on, many of those details the man would not perceive as useful. I'm a man. Sometimes I do the former, more often the latter. And I do feel shamed for that, sometimes. Expecting men and women to fit…
Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)
#193Earlier quoted context omitted.
What is the difference? Give examples of vulnerability that is not also weakness.
I prefer to use the term "open" instead of vulnerable, to avoid exactly the situation you're pointing out. And you can be open without being weak or vulnerable if you have self-confidence. Not faked confidence, but the genuine kind that comes from dealing with your shit instead of repressing it and putting on a mask of fake confidence, strength, stoicism, invulnerability, etc.
Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)
#194I love HN...I've been waiting for this topic :-D I'm a man who has focused on and has been building tools to get better at expressing my emotions since 2012, including an app called iFeelio, in which I answered the question "how do I feel" over 4,000 times across 4 years and a class called Emotional Self-Defense, which I've run in the US, Europe, and Africa. I have realized and re-realized many things along the way.…
Edit: Moodflow seems like it could be good so I'll try that. Just in case this helps others.
Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)
#195I recently did the NWTA weekend retreat with the ManKind Project and found it a surprisingly profound experience. I would recommend it for most men I’ve known. Happy to answer any questions anyone has. I’m not surprised to see so much pushback and gatekeeping here from other men, or suggestions that encouraging men to find spaces to “talk about their feelings” are a radical feminist ploy to subvert true masculinity,…
It's a mainstream idea now that masculinity is toxic, so it's not surprising that people are projecting that onto this. Calling it "New Warrior Training Adventure" comes across as super patronizing. "ManKind" isn't great either. The names alone are surely responsible for much of the pushback that you're seeing. I did a bit of digging though, trying to keep an open mind, and I was surprised to find that MKP is indeed…
I'd say that NWT was the least aggressive about membership recruiting. And est/Landmark was the most. Because their goal is indeed to have everyone do their work. And they're pretty upfront about it.
Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)
#196Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's a mainstream idea now that masculinity is toxic, so it's not surprising that people are projecting that onto this. Calling it "New Warrior Training Adventure" comes across as super patronizing. "ManKind" isn't great either. The names alone are surely responsible for much of the pushback that you're seeing. I did a bit of digging though, trying to keep an open mind, and I was surprised to find that MKP is indeed…
I find the comparisons to cults to be completely bizarre. It's definitely not a cult. Or at least, not a very good one. You can leave if you want, you don't have to participate in anything you don't want to, there's no "drive to recruit more members", or even really to become a member at all, it's staffed by volunteers, there's no central figure or authority like most cults, there's very little pressure to participat…
Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)
#197Believe me, it's not a fun place to be, and I hope new parents do realize how important it is to teach young children how to make sense of their emotions.
Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)
#198Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's a mainstream idea now that masculinity is toxic, so it's not surprising that people are projecting that onto this. Calling it "New Warrior Training Adventure" comes across as super patronizing. "ManKind" isn't great either. The names alone are surely responsible for much of the pushback that you're seeing. I did a bit of digging though, trying to keep an open mind, and I was surprised to find that MKP is indeed…
I find the comparisons to cults to be completely bizarre. It's definitely not a cult. Or at least, not a very good one. You can leave if you want, you don't have to participate in anything you don't want to, there's no "drive to recruit more members", or even really to become a member at all, it's staffed by volunteers, there's no central figure or authority like most cults, there's very little pressure to participat…
First, you are correct that MKP is not a cult and everything you're saying here checks out with the research I just did into MKP.
What I meant was that it is cult-like in appearance. It's an engineered experience for human bonding and introspection. The members are doing stuff that's out of the ordinary and trying to connect to some deeper spiritual thing. Sometimes people get naked. There's a big wooden phallus used as a talking stick. There's a bunch of oversharing. It's not a cult, but it's not exactly Rotary Club either.
As far as roping you in, of course it's designed for that. The group couldn't grow without getting you to come back. There's a good chance you're going to form bonds with the other people in the group if you do a bunch of emotional stuff with them on a retreat. That's a social situation that I'd much prefer to avoid.
I looked at your HN profile and I see that you're a life coach for freelancers, so you might be less sensitive to what's triggering me about MKP. Don't take this the wrong way, but your site gives me a similar feeling as the MKP stuff. I'm pretty sure I'm your target too, as a developer considering switching to freelance work. I wish I could give you something more useful than "feels scammy, stay away", but that's how it comes across to me. And you're blogging about "mastermind groups", which also give me the same feel. It's possible that I'm just hyper-sensitive, but I think you'll have an easier time getting through to developers if you aren't tripping the alarm that tells me "this is a cult" or "here comes a pitch for an ebook".
As a side note, I wonder if you get many calls from putting your number in your HN profile. That was definitely noticeable and didn't trigger my overactive skepticism at all (even though it's obvious self promotion, it feels authentic).
Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)
#199Earlier quoted context omitted.
Our society will always value men who are confident, this is so much deeper to me than being scared to share your feelings because “it’s gay”. Women are attracted to confidence, employers reward confidence, hiring managers are impressed by confidence. Vulnerability and weakness are just not rewarded for men or women, but especially for men.
Most people believe that vulnerability is a weakness and a disadvantage but this is demonstrably untrue. Showing vulnerability is a way to develop rapport and connection with other people. Here is a great example using Jennifer Lawrence who is particularly good at this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btud-zsdmk4 There are definitely caveats to this. It has to be done a certain way. It works better when you already h…
In other words, it’s not the ”oh my god, my life is crashing, I don’t know what to do, please help me” kind of vulnerability (that one isn’t seen as very attractive or welcomed by the society), it’s the “my life is awesome, except this tiny part, but it’s cool, I’ll manage” kind of vulnerability.
Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)
#200Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's a mainstream idea now that masculinity is toxic, so it's not surprising that people are projecting that onto this. Calling it "New Warrior Training Adventure" comes across as super patronizing. "ManKind" isn't great either. The names alone are surely responsible for much of the pushback that you're seeing. I did a bit of digging though, trying to keep an open mind, and I was surprised to find that MKP is indeed…
I've no experience with Scientology, except having a college professor who mentioned it occasionally. But I have done lots of work with est/Landmark, and some with NWT, Tony Robbins and NLP. Plus a bunch of random New Age stuff, and lots of psychedelics. I'd say that NWT was the least aggressive about membership recruiting. And est/Landmark was the most. Because their goal is indeed to have everyone do their work. An…