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Open offices are a dead end

nytimes.com

151–160 of 307 posts

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#151
Probably an unpopular opinion here, but I like open offices.

It's nice being able to turn around and have quick meetings without wasting time looking for a room.

It's also nice being able to scoot a chair over to work with a team member on a problem.

As a general rule people don't interrupt others if they have headphones on.

Maybe it's a problem for companies with product and engineering next to sales. Other than that I'm not entirely sure where all the hate comes from.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#152

If I could craft the perfect job for me, the one I work at would be it - an intelligent straightforward manager who will speak his mind bluntly and can take it just as well as he can dish it out. He’s mostly concerned with results not whether you kiss his ring. - small company without a lot of bureaucracy -- I have full access to our entire AWS infrastructure - relatively generous PTO - a decent free family health pl…

If it’s the perfect job why do you want to pad your CV with junk? Why not pick some stable tech and take the opportunity to get really deeply into it? The only reason to chase buzzwords is if you plan to leave soon!

It’s not about you “planning to leave soon”. Companies leave you, they get acquired, culture changes bosses change, and salary compression is real. The best way to keep making more up to a certain point is to change jobs.

Always keep your running shoes around your neck.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#153
post #146

All you need is some guy to talk loudly on the phone next to you all day and you'll soon come to abhor open offices. Not to mention the scrutiny of others - keeping an eye on how you work, how much you work, when you arrive, when you leave, what you eat etc. It can really be quite horrible at times, especially if your office is quite politically charged. I run a small company in London, and we advertise our jobs with…

Possible to reveal the name of the company please ?

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#154

If I could craft the perfect job for me, the one I work at would be it - an intelligent straightforward manager who will speak his mind bluntly and can take it just as well as he can dish it out. He’s mostly concerned with results not whether you kiss his ring. - small company without a lot of bureaucracy -- I have full access to our entire AWS infrastructure - relatively generous PTO - a decent free family health pl…

What do you consider "relatively generous PTO"? No axe to grind, I'm just curious.

4 weeks up to 3 years and 5 weeks after that. The standard seems to be three. I’ve even seen 2.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I could buy into it if the rational is it's far cheaper to fit more employees in less space. That's a fine reason. It sucks to work in, but I can at least hear that without rolling my eyes and dismissing everything else that person says as incredulous. Raytheon, for all its other faults, was at least largely honest about why they were shrinking cube sizes and experimenting with open floor plans. There was some half…

I think it's an important distinction to say that is isn't a space issue, it's a money issue.

Yes and no. Ultimately, any space issue can be solved with enough money, so yes. But space usually isn't easily expanded. My company has the 7th floor of a 10-floor building. When we hire people as we've been doing, we can either fit them into the existing space somehow, or... move the entire office? Rent space on the floor above or below? It isn't as easy as just "spend a bit more money, get a bit more space," so no.

Ultimately, when they moved into this building, they spent quite a bit more than they needed to for the entire floor, knowing they expected to grow. Now they're cramming people in too closely and will probably have to move to a larger building in the future. In the meantime, however...

So yeah, it's a space issue first and foremost, and a money issue only secondarily.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#156
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unpopular, yes, but you're not wrong because you're talking about only yourself. I think the point many people are trying to make is that open offices decrease productivity for most people .

> I think the point many people are trying to make is that open offices decrease productivity for most people. I don't think people stop there, however. Many people, including the author of the article, go the extra step to say that open offices are bad. I don't think you can argue against the fact that a significant portion of the population works well in open offices, so when you say stuff like "open offices are a…

> I don't think you can argue against the fact that a significant portion of the population works well in open offices

Can you cite a study which asserts this fact?

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#157
post #51
post #14

In the four years at my current company we went full cubes -> half cubes (you get like 2-3 regular walls and one baby wall) -> open office -> open office no assigned desks. I can't wait to see the next iteration on this.

-> no assigned computers -> no assigned tickets, each day you'll continue working where someone left it the day before.

-> Bring Your Own Desk

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The ability for an open office to foster pair-programming and intense collaboration was a real benefit, though it certainly doesn't suit everyone. How much of your day do you spend in intense collaboration?

I've been at companies where I spent perhaps 7 out of 8 hour in a day pair programming, and it was the most productive I've ever been. As the parent comment said, it's not for everyone. Nothing is for everyone--there are many different work styles.

That sounds like a great argument against open offices. I could not handle sitting near two people pair programming the whole day. If they went to a private office to do it that would seem ideal.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#159
post #140

If I could craft the perfect job for me, the one I work at would be it - an intelligent straightforward manager who will speak his mind bluntly and can take it just as well as he can dish it out. He’s mostly concerned with results not whether you kiss his ring. - small company without a lot of bureaucracy -- I have full access to our entire AWS infrastructure - relatively generous PTO - a decent free family health pl…

Hey! I actually have all of the things on your list. But with one catch: I work for a community nonprofit in a small town of 15,000 people in the deep south, and make probably a very small fraction of what you do. I guess life is all about compromise :)

You said "all", but its not really all without "payment up to date with the market" ;).

Ps. I would not care so much for payment if I was born 5-10 years earlier. I would already have a big house with nice big garden and few cars. Now to get the same - have to pay 15x as much as my brother who is older than me :) Great times we live in..

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#160
post #57

I think I'd have a less negative reaction to open offices if it weren't for the attempt to sell it as a productivity booster . The article even mentions how they're "sold to workers as a boon to collaboration — liberated from barriers, stuffed in like sardines, people would chat more and, supposedly, come up with lots of brilliant new ideas". Thankfully the author also quickly refuted that. Yet the insanity remains,…

I dunno man, I (software engineer for 21 years) like the open office, at my last job we had real offices and my coworker and I cut a huge window sized hole in the drywall between our offices so we could easier communicate/chat. I can’t count how many times a random casual conversation saved the day or generated new ideas. If I need to focus I put on headphones.

Logistically it seems unlikely open offices will go away, software heavy business can’t just spread their workforce over 3x the space, especially in dense urban areas. Better to come up with novel solutions for deep work, like dedicated open area library/dark dungeon rooms.

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