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Open offices are a dead end

nytimes.com

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Re: Open offices are a dead end

#141

Post by bityard »

duxup wrote: post #8

I have a visceral response to that photo in the article. I do not need folks right on top of me like that. My solution is that I often wear Shooting Earmuffs (you guys who listen to music all the time, i don't get it, i can't do that) to lower my awareness of all the chatter... even when I do have an office. Fortunately folks around me are understanding.

> (you guys who listen to music all the time, i don't get it, i can't do that)

While working, I can't listen to music that has any lyrics in it whatsoever, otherwise my mind is listening to the words instead of focusing on the work.

So, electronic music. I used to love being immersed in code while listening to house and progressive except that in the last decade or so most of the new stuff has shifted closer to mainstream pop in that most tracks now have divas or bros in the foreground. Blegh.

Anyway, clearly we're all wired differently because lots of the people I work with (and have worked with) can focus just fine while listening to lyric-laden pop, alternative, metal, whatever. It's interesting.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#142

Post by dtech »

chomp wrote: post #112
ivl wrote: post #57

I think I'd have a less negative reaction to open offices if it weren't for the attempt to sell it as a productivity booster . The article even mentions how they're "sold to workers as a boon to collaboration — liberated from barriers, stuffed in like sardines, people would chat more and, supposedly, come up with lots of brilliant new ideas". Thankfully the author also quickly refuted that. Yet the insanity remains,…

I think part of the problem is that (in my experience) open offices actually do boost productivity somewhat, but only when the office is a small 2-5 person pod. I lose productivity when I get dropped in a huge floor of people chatting and talking about things not related to what I'm working on.

I wouldn't call that an open office though, just a team room.

A shared space is fine with <5 people, can become problematic at 5-10 people and the frequently 20+ large floor spaces are just unworkable without noise cancelling headphones.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#143

Post by ehnto »

themodelplumber wrote: post #115
pmlnr wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> - up to date with technology and great chances for resume building. Resume driver development is bad for the planet, you, for everything. Java programmers still find jobs; COBOL programmers are still needed; FORTRAN is still alive, so I'd rather find something that will not go away in my lifetime than trying to keep up with trends.

There's really something to this. A friend of mine recently received an email to her dev shop criticizing her for using PHP. The funny thing is, she knows the guy who sent the email. He runs an IT business and sent an article to her client about the latest web technologies, then the client said "we use PHP, is that OK?" to which IT guy, with close to zero web experience, replied that it wasn't. I was pretty upset on…

Very important parts of the web continue to use PHP. Forget WordPress, we're talking fast, scaleable, well engineered applications built by software engineers, being used by millions of people a day. Built using the same software engineering principles you would use in any other language. It's just a language after all, and both the language and it's community have matured a great deal.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#144

Post by marcodave »

soneca wrote: post #25
duxup wrote: post #8

I have a visceral response to that photo in the article. I do not need folks right on top of me like that. My solution is that I often wear Shooting Earmuffs (you guys who listen to music all the time, i don't get it, i can't do that) to lower my awareness of all the chatter... even when I do have an office. Fortunately folks around me are understanding.

I just recently discovered I have a super power: easily zoom out from a lot of chatter in a crowded small room. The secret is that I am a non-native English speaker working in the US. I can understand and speak very well... when I am focused on it. If I am not consciously making an effort to understand the chat in the room, it is almost like white noise.

> If I am not consciously making an effort to understand the chat in the room, it is almost like white noise.

Heh, I also feel the same, as a non-hungarian working in Budapest, and what's funny is that historically Hungarian was (is?) used by movies as the "white noise background language" by some directors.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#145

Post by Traubenfuchs »

lawn wrote: post #51
sct202 wrote: post #14

In the four years at my current company we went full cubes -> half cubes (you get like 2-3 regular walls and one baby wall) -> open office -> open office no assigned desks. I can't wait to see the next iteration on this.

-> no assigned computers -> no assigned tickets, each day you'll continue working where someone left it the day before.

I love it. You could call it x-functional hyper-agile.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#146

Post by osrec »

All you need is some guy to talk loudly on the phone next to you all day and you'll soon come to abhor open offices. Not to mention the scrutiny of others - keeping an eye on how you work, how much you work, when you arrive, when you leave, what you eat etc. It can really be quite horrible at times, especially if your office is quite politically charged.

I run a small company in London, and we advertise our jobs with "closed" offices/remote as being a unique selling point! I think people prefer to work without being watched, and can really take ownership of their task without feeling conscious - they can get into that coveted state of "flow".

As a manager, I also don't want to watch over my staff all day. I'm not their owner, I'm just their manager. My aim is to let them do what they're good at, and being comfortable enough to let them get on with things is the best way to keep them productive.

And if someone isn't productive, it's obvious from their results. No open office/constant scrutiny required.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#147

Post by amyjess »

utf985 wrote: post #123

I get a bit bewildered every time I see someone complaining about open offices as it always begs the question - what kind of alternative do they demand exactly? I have addressed this on many threads and comments but somehow I never gen an answer. Only thing I can think of are cubicles but to me they seem a lot worse than the open office and they're definitely not a thing here in Europe. Out of all the companies and i…

I want a traditional cube farm.

I actually work in one right now. I love my company, and pretty much the only thing that could get me to quit would be if they dropped the cube farm and switched to an open office.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#148

Post by amyjess »

andreygrehov wrote: post #3

I hate open offices. What software companies offer at least cubicles?

I don't really like talking about real life too much, so I'm hesitant to mention the company by name (you can probably find it in my history though), but I work for an enterprise ISP, and we have cubicles.

I'm very happy here.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#149

Post by utf985 »

reroute1 wrote: post #138
utf985 wrote: post #123

I get a bit bewildered every time I see someone complaining about open offices as it always begs the question - what kind of alternative do they demand exactly? I have addressed this on many threads and comments but somehow I never gen an answer. Only thing I can think of are cubicles but to me they seem a lot worse than the open office and they're definitely not a thing here in Europe. Out of all the companies and i…

Cubicles, working remote, conference rooms. You ask for alternatives but automatically rule out the largest alternative (cubicles)? Feels like your expectations are the odd ones

As I said, they're basically non-existent here, so they're definitely not an alternative for me.

Re: Open offices are a dead end

#150

Post by scarface74 »

pmlnr wrote: post #90
scarface74 wrote: post #16

If I could craft the perfect job for me, the one I work at would be it - an intelligent straightforward manager who will speak his mind bluntly and can take it just as well as he can dish it out. He’s mostly concerned with results not whether you kiss his ring. - small company without a lot of bureaucracy -- I have full access to our entire AWS infrastructure - relatively generous PTO - a decent free family health pl…

> - up to date with technology and great chances for resume building. Resume driver development is bad for the planet, you, for everything. Java programmers still find jobs; COBOL programmers are still needed; FORTRAN is still alive, so I'd rather find something that will not go away in my lifetime than trying to keep up with trends.

Good Luck With That.

In 2008, I was looking for a job after being with one company for close to a decade. I knew C and C++ like the back of my hand and written programs for x86 PCs as well as three mainframes (Stratus VOS, DEC VAX, and one that I cant remember.) When it was time to find a job, after a few months,

I found one company and a mid level job (that paid more because salary compression is real) that wanted my VB6 skills because they were moving away from a proprietary VB6 like language and moving to C#. Later, my C++/MFC skills came in handy when they needed someone to maintain their proprietary development system.

Fast forward three years later and the company died laying everyone off. Knowing the situation of the company, I did a lot of Resume Driven Development with C#. It took four days from the time I called some recruiters to getting an offer from what was then a F10 non tech company.

It’s been the same every since as I slowly moved up to where my salary and responsibly has matched my years of experience. All based on seeing what the local market wants and keeping my resume in line with it. RDD means optionality. You can literally make a few phone calls and have multiple offers in hand with in a couple of weeks if you live in any major metro area. I live in Atlanta.

Even with Java if you say your expertise is writing Java applets and EJBs you will be laughed at.

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