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America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

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Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#201

Post by trianglem »

epx wrote: post #5
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #3

>But after a lifetime in service of the feminist cause, she took on the case of a friend whose son she came to believe had been wrongly convicted of rape and won his acquittal on appeal. This is one of the big ways in which sexism is a much more tractable problem than racism and less potentially explosive. Women and men both have members of the opposite sex that they genuinely love. I have heard that fathers with dau…

Quite an optimistic view. Hope you are right.

What exactly is optimistic about the post?

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#202

Post by creato »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #188
dgzl wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't really help you with networking, and I'm not the kind of person who thinks things like being high-ranked entitles you to something other than bragging rights. I certainly don't know enough about the blogging scene to help you there. I don't see the justification in calling HN a Boy's Club either, as there are zero barriers to participate other than a computer. That term is usually used when people exclude wom…

I don't see the justification in calling HN a Boy's Club either, as there are zero barriers to participate other than a computer. That term is usually used when people exclude women from the group because they are women, but nobody here knows or cares what sex you are. It is overwhelmingly male. There is plenty of evidence that women would like to participate more but are put off by some of what goes on here. Yes, I…

> I made the leader board. That accomplishment doesn't get credited to me.

I don't know if this really means anything, but: I've been here for years off and on, I had idea what the "HN leader board is". I couldn't find it by navigating through the site UI either, I had to google it to find it.

Looking at it, it's barely identifiable information. Some profiles have more identification, but many didn't. How is this even remotely close to a useful networking tool? If there's a correlation at all between "HN leaderboard status" and career success, I think that's a secondary correlation.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#203

Post by avar »

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #3

>But after a lifetime in service of the feminist cause, she took on the case of a friend whose son she came to believe had been wrongly convicted of rape and won his acquittal on appeal. This is one of the big ways in which sexism is a much more tractable problem than racism and less potentially explosive. Women and men both have members of the opposite sex that they genuinely love. I have heard that fathers with dau…

The notion that fathers who have daughters can't be sexist towards women is taking a really narrow view of sexism.

You can think that women aren't responsible enough to vote, or to hold certain jobs while still loving your daughter. You can kick it back with your black friend on the weekend while still not wanting black people in your neighborhood, your friends is just "one of the good ones".

Most of human society throughout history has been profoundly sexist by modern standards, and we still have entire countries that are structurally sexist by the standards of the west. None of that was destabilized because everyone had a mother, and most fathers had daughters.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#204

Post by manfredo »

rayiner wrote: post #162
mirimir wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From TFA, which I quoted in another subthread: > As Catharine Mackinnon, the progenitor of the school of feminism from which this movement proceeds, once put it, "Politically, I call it rape whenever a woman has sex and feels violated." Maybe she's not a "modern feminist". But that's the sense I get from TFA about current policies.

MacKinnon's quote is not referring to an after-the-fact change of mind. Her point is that women may, under coercive circumstances, consent but nonetheless still feel violated. She posits that women may revoke consent after the fact, but the basis for that revocation is coercive circumstances that existed at the time of the act . This is less far-fetched than it may seem at first. Many people on HN would agree with th…

> MacKinnon's quote is not referring to an after-the-fact change of mind. Her point is that women may, under coercive circumstances, consent but nonetheless still feel violated. She posits that women may revoke consent after the fact, but the basis for that revocation is coercive circumstances that existed at the time of the act

This is injecting your own message into what was written. MacKinnion wrote that, "Politically, I call it rape whenever a woman has sex and feels violated". Feelings of violation can manifest after sex, and it is an assumption on your part that this does not fall into scope of what MacKinnon considers sex. MacKinnon wrote that she considers it rape "whenever" women feel violated, so at face value this encompasses feelings of violation that manifest after the fact.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#205

Post by seventhtiger »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #155
dgzl wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>A whole lot of this BS is rooted in the idea that a woman's sexuality is a prize to be won by an "eligible" male -- ie a man who earns enough to take care of her. There is a subtext of ownership there. Both sides perpetuate this, but I see this coming from women much more than men.

Perhaps that's because most women need a man's income to not be dirt poor. I appear to be the highest ranked woman on HN. I appear to be the only woman to ever have spent time on the leader board. It has resulted in nearly zero professional connections. When I complain about that, I get blown off and told that's not something I should expect from HN, nevermind that it works that way for plenty of men. I was homeless…

Don't disrespect the agency of women. Do not victimize them when they do something wrong by blaming it on society.

I don't see anything unique to your financial or professional situation that suggests it's due to your gender. Before being a woman you are a person. If you're in a situation that any man or woman could find themselves in then ask what is it about you as a person that you got you here.

The more you blame your gender the less room you give yourself to develop.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#206

Post by jamesrcole »

avar wrote: post #203
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #3

>But after a lifetime in service of the feminist cause, she took on the case of a friend whose son she came to believe had been wrongly convicted of rape and won his acquittal on appeal. This is one of the big ways in which sexism is a much more tractable problem than racism and less potentially explosive. Women and men both have members of the opposite sex that they genuinely love. I have heard that fathers with dau…

The notion that fathers who have daughters can't be sexist towards women is taking a really narrow view of sexism. You can think that women aren't responsible enough to vote, or to hold certain jobs while still loving your daughter. You can kick it back with your black friend on the weekend while still not wanting black people in your neighborhood, your friends is just "one of the good ones". Most of human society th…

>> Women and men both have members of the opposite sex that they genuinely love. I have heard that fathers with daughters make for a very tough jury in rape cases.

> The notion that fathers who have daughters can't be sexist towards women

You're misrepresenting what the person said.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#207

Post by dgzl »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #188
dgzl wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't really help you with networking, and I'm not the kind of person who thinks things like being high-ranked entitles you to something other than bragging rights. I certainly don't know enough about the blogging scene to help you there. I don't see the justification in calling HN a Boy's Club either, as there are zero barriers to participate other than a computer. That term is usually used when people exclude wom…

I don't see the justification in calling HN a Boy's Club either, as there are zero barriers to participate other than a computer. That term is usually used when people exclude women from the group because they are women, but nobody here knows or cares what sex you are. It is overwhelmingly male. There is plenty of evidence that women would like to participate more but are put off by some of what goes on here. Yes, I…

I think you're very wrong, and I'm going to leave it at that.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#208

Post by manfredo »

avar wrote: post #203
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #3

>But after a lifetime in service of the feminist cause, she took on the case of a friend whose son she came to believe had been wrongly convicted of rape and won his acquittal on appeal. This is one of the big ways in which sexism is a much more tractable problem than racism and less potentially explosive. Women and men both have members of the opposite sex that they genuinely love. I have heard that fathers with dau…

The notion that fathers who have daughters can't be sexist towards women is taking a really narrow view of sexism. You can think that women aren't responsible enough to vote, or to hold certain jobs while still loving your daughter. You can kick it back with your black friend on the weekend while still not wanting black people in your neighborhood, your friends is just "one of the good ones". Most of human society th…

> The notion that fathers who have daughters can't be sexist towards women is taking a really narrow view of sexism.

Nowhere was that written in the above comment

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#209

Post by cameldrv »

Lazare wrote: post #60
mieseratte wrote: post #4

For the life of me I don’t understand why government funded institutions run their own tribunals. Send it through the proper court system, if the accused is guilty you can expel them cleanly.

If I run a startup, and one of my employees is making other employees uncomfortable, and he keeps getting accused of harassing other employees, and is generally just making some of my best engineers unhappy, hurting productivity, and ruining our carefully constructed culture... ...I can fire him. I mean, obviously I need to go through the proper HR procedures, follow local employment law, respect the terms of his con…

Weirdly, the situation is exactly the opposite of what you describe. You might say "hey, it's a private organization, they should be free to make their own rules about who they choose to serve." Many businesses before the civil rights act made exactly the same argument as they excluded African Americans as customers. This type of discrimination was made illegal.

The strange thing is that it is precisely this type of law that has created this situation. The Feds assert that if a university does not apply these extraordinarily dubious adjudication rules for sexual harassment and rape, then it is discriminating against women and is subject to losing any federal funding, including student loans, which effectively shuts down the university.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#210

Post by jamesrcole »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #188
dgzl wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't really help you with networking, and I'm not the kind of person who thinks things like being high-ranked entitles you to something other than bragging rights. I certainly don't know enough about the blogging scene to help you there. I don't see the justification in calling HN a Boy's Club either, as there are zero barriers to participate other than a computer. That term is usually used when people exclude wom…

I don't see the justification in calling HN a Boy's Club either, as there are zero barriers to participate other than a computer. That term is usually used when people exclude women from the group because they are women, but nobody here knows or cares what sex you are. It is overwhelmingly male. There is plenty of evidence that women would like to participate more but are put off by some of what goes on here. Yes, I…

> I made the leader board. That accomplishment doesn't get credited to me.

How should such an accomplishment be credited?

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