Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

nakedsecurity.sophos.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–48 of 48 posts

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#41

Post by bane »

tptacek wrote: post #38
bane wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you think somebody who broke into an email account should serve more time if the wheels of justice are properly turning? Would that imply then that other, clearly more serious crimes, that result in similar sentences, should have their sentences increased to be proportional? I'm not asking to be judgmental, I'm honestly curious. In my mind, breaking into a mailbox isn't that big of a deal in most cases. But I can…

Correct. That is what I think. Incidentally, breaking into a physical mailbox is a much bigger deal, which makes zero sense to me.

Perhaps then, there should be wider sentencing leeway?

Incidentally, breaking into a physical mailbox is a much bigger deal, which makes zero sense to me.

So far, most people think that physical incursions into a person's private things are more serious than virtual incursions. Perhaps it's the physical safety aspect of it that they think is important.

For what it's worth, I think virtual privacy should be treated exactly the same as physical privacy, and sadly the law hasn't quite figured that out (I think we're in agreement on this)

But I disagree with you that punishment should always be severe. I think data shows that severe punishments do little to prevent crime, and end up just costing everybody lots of tax dollars in incarceration costs.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#42

Post by tptacek »

jbooth wrote: post #33
jerf wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't a prank. This is an attempt to influence the election of the most important position in the land using felonious means. He's lucky he's only getting what he's getting, what he did is far more serious. It is blindingly obvious that most expressions of sympathy here are because people approve of the target of the felonious actions. Had he hacked Biden's email the press would have called for his head and wrun…

Had he hacked Biden's blog, he probably wouldn't have found official business illegally done on a personal email. How come Palin hasn't been charged with anything? She just resigns and people don't bother to follow up. That's fine and all, but it's a nice backdrop to this kid getting the book thrown at him.

There is immense incentive within the state of Alaska --- where Palin is extremely unpopular (in Wasilla, her hometown, her memoir is shelved at a bookstore under "Alaska Fiction") --- to charge Palin with crimes. She has been under near continuous investigation since assuming statewide office.

The only people I see suggesting that this email spool contained evidence of wrongdoing are partisan armchair legal theorists. And, for the record, I think Palin is a genuine force for evil in our country.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#43

Post by tptacek »

bane wrote: post #41
tptacek wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Correct. That is what I think. Incidentally, breaking into a physical mailbox is a much bigger deal, which makes zero sense to me.

Perhaps then, there should be wider sentencing leeway? Incidentally, breaking into a physical mailbox is a much bigger deal, which makes zero sense to me. So far, most people think that physical incursions into a person's private things are more serious than virtual incursions. Perhaps it's the physical safety aspect of it that they think is important. For what it's worth, I think virtual privacy should be treated ex…

I agree that there should be wider sentencing leeway in general. I think much more should be left to the discretion of judges.

I do not agree --- in fact, I militantly disagree --- with the notion that physical harm should be more severely punished than virtual harm. Crimes should be punished based on the harm they cause and based on society's interests in deterring crimes. The ease with which a crime is committed should not be a factor in its sentencing.

All crimes are going to get easier to commit this century.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#44

Post by mikeryan »

bugsy wrote: post #34
mikeryan wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just be be sure we're clear on the "crime", it was that he guessed Palin's yahoo mail security question No actually the "crime" was "anticipatory obstruction of justice" for destroying evidence in a federal investigation. Actually accessing the account was a misdemeanor. Look I think this is a stupid kid who doesn't deserve a year a in jail. But you don't get to trivialize a crime because it was "easy". Just because…

It does affect the crime though and is a big difference. If the door is closed and locked it is breaking and entering which is a felony that brings prison time. If the door is open and unlocked it's trespassing which is a misdemeanor and will seldom get jail time.

Nope, picking a lock and entering a house and entering a house with an unlocked door is the same crime the only differences between trespass and burglary are based on the intent with which you enter and what you do once you get there. Its also a lot easier to prove intent if you break a window or pick a lock.

Do you really think a criminal who walks up to a house with a lock pick in hand and then finds the door unlocked gets charged with a lesser crime?

From Legal Dictionary's entry on "Breaking and Entering"

"The criminal act of entering a residence or other enclosed property through the slightest amount of force (even pushing open a door), without authorization. If there is intent to commit a crime, this is burglary. If there is no such intent, the breaking and entering alone is probably at least illegal trespass, which is a misdemeanor crime. 2) the criminal charge for the above."

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#45

Post by jbooth »

tptacek wrote: post #42
jbooth wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Had he hacked Biden's blog, he probably wouldn't have found official business illegally done on a personal email. How come Palin hasn't been charged with anything? She just resigns and people don't bother to follow up. That's fine and all, but it's a nice backdrop to this kid getting the book thrown at him.

There is immense incentive within the state of Alaska --- where Palin is extremely unpopular (in Wasilla, her hometown, her memoir is shelved at a bookstore under "Alaska Fiction") --- to charge Palin with crimes. She has been under near continuous investigation since assuming statewide office. The only people I see suggesting that this email spool contained evidence of wrongdoing are partisan armchair legal theorist…

Is there, though? I mean, she was being investigated for a bunch of things, going after people who had p'd off her husband and such, and then it just dropped after she left office. Bush is unpopular too, but I don't see anyone going after any of the stuff that his admin did.

Meanwhile, if your email was hacked? No way the feds take the case. That's what I'm upset about, mostly. The dufus broke the law but it seems we have an entirely different standard for enforcement.

RE: evidence of wrongdoing, state business over personal email is illegal, period, and for very good reasons. This is professional ethics 101 if you've taken an oath to serve the public in elected office. If you're doing public business, it has to be on the record. It's legal not theory, it's legal fact.. if it applies to an Alderman, it applies to the Governor.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#46

Post by throwaway1138 »

pothibo wrote: post #21

That's ridiculous. That means that EVERYONE who has used http://codebutler.com/firesheep can go to prison.

Firesheep is a tool to enable the easy theft of credentials. If you think it's legal, I don't know what to tell you.

The thing about Firesheep is that it is inherently difficult to figure out which of the 30 people in the coffeeshop hijacked your session. It's not exactly as if they have a separate IP or something. Just because it's hard to get caught doesn't mean that it's okay to do, though.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#47

Post by bugsy »

mikeryan wrote: post #44
bugsy wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does affect the crime though and is a big difference. If the door is closed and locked it is breaking and entering which is a felony that brings prison time. If the door is open and unlocked it's trespassing which is a misdemeanor and will seldom get jail time.

Nope, picking a lock and entering a house and entering a house with an unlocked door is the same crime the only differences between trespass and burglary are based on the intent with which you enter and what you do once you get there. Its also a lot easier to prove intent if you break a window or pick a lock. Do you really think a criminal who walks up to a house with a lock pick in hand and then finds the door unloc…

What do you mean "nope", you just repeated what I said!

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#48

Post by jerf »

jbooth wrote: post #33
jerf wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't a prank. This is an attempt to influence the election of the most important position in the land using felonious means. He's lucky he's only getting what he's getting, what he did is far more serious. It is blindingly obvious that most expressions of sympathy here are because people approve of the target of the felonious actions. Had he hacked Biden's email the press would have called for his head and wrun…

Had he hacked Biden's blog, he probably wouldn't have found official business illegally done on a personal email. How come Palin hasn't been charged with anything? She just resigns and people don't bother to follow up. That's fine and all, but it's a nice backdrop to this kid getting the book thrown at him.

So, there are two wrongs here instead of one. So what? When did "two wrongs make a right" become the height of debate instead of a childish error?

And people wonder why I see "politics!" pouring forth from every orifice here. Put them both in jail. If that's what the rule of law demands, do it. Doesn't bother me. I want to live in a country where my elected officials do their dealings on the record as required by law and people are not allowed to break into my email merely because I am a politically unpopular target. (Thanks to the fact that I think this way, I'll never not be on the politically unpopular list if one is ever actually allowed to come into existence. Freedom's important.)

Post reply on HN