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Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

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Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#31

Post by tptacek »

mikeryan wrote: post #18
bugsy wrote: post #4

Just be be sure we're clear on the "crime", it was that he guessed Palin's yahoo mail security question "Where did you meet your spouse?" to which the answer was "Wasilla High". source: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2008/09/palin-e-mail-ha/ He didn't even have to guess or crack a password. This is really a major security flaw on yahoo's part, which still exists. The fix in the meantime is to avoid accounts with su…

Just be be sure we're clear on the "crime", it was that he guessed Palin's yahoo mail security question No actually the "crime" was "anticipatory obstruction of justice" for destroying evidence in a federal investigation. Actually accessing the account was a misdemeanor. Look I think this is a stupid kid who doesn't deserve a year a in jail. But you don't get to trivialize a crime because it was "easy". Just because…

Inaccurate. The crimes charged were identity theft, wire fraud, and obstruction. The prosecution has broad discretion to choose what to charge. They chose poorly here. There are US felony statutes that pertain to unauthorized statutes; they require a (low) threshold of quantified damages and have a lower penalty attached to them compared to identity theft, but had he been charged with them, he'd be doing significantly more than a year in prison.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#32

Post by mikeryan »

tptacek wrote: post #31
mikeryan wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just be be sure we're clear on the "crime", it was that he guessed Palin's yahoo mail security question No actually the "crime" was "anticipatory obstruction of justice" for destroying evidence in a federal investigation. Actually accessing the account was a misdemeanor. Look I think this is a stupid kid who doesn't deserve a year a in jail. But you don't get to trivialize a crime because it was "easy". Just because…

Inaccurate. The crimes charged were identity theft, wire fraud, and obstruction. The prosecution has broad discretion to choose what to charge. They chose poorly here. There are US felony statutes that pertain to unauthorized statutes; they require a (low) threshold of quantified damages and have a lower penalty attached to them compared to identity theft, but had he been charged with them, he'd be doing significantl…

I'm actually just speaking to the charges for which he was convicted, not what he was charged with (based off the wikipedia article).

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#33

Post by jbooth »

jerf wrote: post #20
marcusbooster wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's so such thing as being "dinged" with a felony. He will wear that albatross around his neck for the rest of his life. It's not an "injustice of a cosmic scale" so it may not rise to your threshold of caring, but he's still a young man going to prison for what is essentially a prank. Have a little compassion.

This isn't a prank. This is an attempt to influence the election of the most important position in the land using felonious means. He's lucky he's only getting what he's getting, what he did is far more serious. It is blindingly obvious that most expressions of sympathy here are because people approve of the target of the felonious actions. Had he hacked Biden's email the press would have called for his head and wrun…

Had he hacked Biden's blog, he probably wouldn't have found official business illegally done on a personal email.

How come Palin hasn't been charged with anything? She just resigns and people don't bother to follow up. That's fine and all, but it's a nice backdrop to this kid getting the book thrown at him.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#34

Post by bugsy »

mikeryan wrote: post #18
bugsy wrote: post #4

Just be be sure we're clear on the "crime", it was that he guessed Palin's yahoo mail security question "Where did you meet your spouse?" to which the answer was "Wasilla High". source: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2008/09/palin-e-mail-ha/ He didn't even have to guess or crack a password. This is really a major security flaw on yahoo's part, which still exists. The fix in the meantime is to avoid accounts with su…

Just be be sure we're clear on the "crime", it was that he guessed Palin's yahoo mail security question No actually the "crime" was "anticipatory obstruction of justice" for destroying evidence in a federal investigation. Actually accessing the account was a misdemeanor. Look I think this is a stupid kid who doesn't deserve a year a in jail. But you don't get to trivialize a crime because it was "easy". Just because…

It does affect the crime though and is a big difference.

If the door is closed and locked it is breaking and entering which is a felony that brings prison time.

If the door is open and unlocked it's trespassing which is a misdemeanor and will seldom get jail time.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#35

Post by [deleted] »

raganwald wrote: post #16
bugsy wrote: post #4

Just be be sure we're clear on the "crime", it was that he guessed Palin's yahoo mail security question "Where did you meet your spouse?" to which the answer was "Wasilla High". source: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2008/09/palin-e-mail-ha/ He didn't even have to guess or crack a password. This is really a major security flaw on yahoo's part, which still exists. The fix in the meantime is to avoid accounts with su…

Using a bag twisty to hold a gate is considered _exactly_ the same as a chain and a padlock for the purposes of trespassing. If it's clear to you that you aren't to enter my property, you don't enter my property and it doesn't matter how difficult I make it for you to do what you already know is wrong. The issue here is the severity of the sentence, not his guilt, and especially not blaming the victim.

[deleted]

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#36

Post by bugsy »

raganwald wrote: post #16
bugsy wrote: post #4

Just be be sure we're clear on the "crime", it was that he guessed Palin's yahoo mail security question "Where did you meet your spouse?" to which the answer was "Wasilla High". source: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2008/09/palin-e-mail-ha/ He didn't even have to guess or crack a password. This is really a major security flaw on yahoo's part, which still exists. The fix in the meantime is to avoid accounts with su…

Using a bag twisty to hold a gate is considered _exactly_ the same as a chain and a padlock for the purposes of trespassing. If it's clear to you that you aren't to enter my property, you don't enter my property and it doesn't matter how difficult I make it for you to do what you already know is wrong. The issue here is the severity of the sentence, not his guilt, and especially not blaming the victim.

No. A padlock is clearly to say this area is forbidden, do not enter. A twisty can mean the latch is broken and the twisty is stopping the gate from blowing open in the wind, but not intended to stop anyone from entering. No reasonable person would look at a gate with a twisty and conclude that was intended to stop people from entering. It is obviously a stopgap measure to keep the gate from blowing open, not to stop people from using the gate.

Let's say kids on the street are playing and their frisbee goes into your yard. They come to the gate and there is a chain and padlock. They find some bolt cutters, cut the chain and retrieve the frisbee - that's breaking, entering and vandalism!

OK, stop, rewind. Instead of a chain and padlock the gate is held closed with a twisty. They untwist the twisty, retrieve the frisbee and leave. So the police will arrest and the jury will convict them of the same crime - breaking, entering and vandalism, right? Wrong! Nothing will happen because no crime was committed by opening the twisty gate.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#37

Post by bane »

tptacek wrote: post #30
bane wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe the bigger question is, is this a proportional response for his crime?

No. The prosecution screwed up and hung a case on identity theft and wire fraud instead of 18 U.S.C. § 1030 or similar statute, so he is essentially serving time solely for destroying evidence.

So you think somebody who broke into an email account should serve more time if the wheels of justice are properly turning?

Would that imply then that other, clearly more serious crimes, that result in similar sentences, should have their sentences increased to be proportional?

I'm not asking to be judgmental, I'm honestly curious. In my mind, breaking into a mailbox isn't that big of a deal in most cases. But I can recognize an alternate argument such as "what if the mailbox in question contained corporate secrets worth billions of dollars".

In the former a year or more sentence seems excessive, in the later case a year would seem insufficient.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#38

Post by tptacek »

bane wrote: post #37
tptacek wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. The prosecution screwed up and hung a case on identity theft and wire fraud instead of 18 U.S.C. § 1030 or similar statute, so he is essentially serving time solely for destroying evidence.

So you think somebody who broke into an email account should serve more time if the wheels of justice are properly turning? Would that imply then that other, clearly more serious crimes, that result in similar sentences, should have their sentences increased to be proportional? I'm not asking to be judgmental, I'm honestly curious. In my mind, breaking into a mailbox isn't that big of a deal in most cases. But I can…

Correct. That is what I think. Incidentally, breaking into a physical mailbox is a much bigger deal, which makes zero sense to me.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#39

Post by tptacek »

mikeryan wrote: post #32
tptacek wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Inaccurate. The crimes charged were identity theft, wire fraud, and obstruction. The prosecution has broad discretion to choose what to charge. They chose poorly here. There are US felony statutes that pertain to unauthorized statutes; they require a (low) threshold of quantified damages and have a lower penalty attached to them compared to identity theft, but had he been charged with them, he'd be doing significantl…

I'm actually just speaking to the charges for which he was convicted, not what he was charged with (based off the wikipedia article).

I'm just making it clear that they didn't take him to court for clearing his browser cache; they went after him for breaking into the email account, but did so hamhandedly.

Re: Sarah Palin’s email hacker is imprisoned, against judge’s recommendation

#40

Post by bugsy »

duskwuff wrote: post #13
bugsy wrote: post #4

Just be be sure we're clear on the "crime", it was that he guessed Palin's yahoo mail security question "Where did you meet your spouse?" to which the answer was "Wasilla High". source: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2008/09/palin-e-mail-ha/ He didn't even have to guess or crack a password. This is really a major security flaw on yahoo's part, which still exists. The fix in the meantime is to avoid accounts with su…

> Easily guessable security questions like mother's maiden name as used by banks should not be considered legitimate protection any more than using a bag twisty to hold a gate closed should be considered the same as a chain and padlock. Related: http://i.imgur.com/rGtgr.jpg

Yes, well that's an edge condition. Hard cases make bad law.
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