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Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

thetimes.co.uk

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Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#221

Post by viburnum »

capableweb wrote: post #207
viburnum wrote: post #59

Can’t find it right now, but I recall some research showing that friendship for men is basically with whatever other men you’re around the most. If you’re a man and want more friends, you probably need to get a new job. Or make a long-term commitment to showing up to the same place where other men are also committed to showing up (AA meetings, church, sports team, etc). Or just be friends with the husbands of your wi…

> some research showing that friendship for women is basically with whatever other women you’re around the most. If you’re a woman and want more friends, you probably need to get a new job. Or make a long-term commitment to showing up to the same place where other women are also committed to showing up (AA meetings, church, sports team, etc). Or just be friends with the wifes of your husband’s friends. I replaced "me…

Not really. It’s possible for women to say, “I love your earrings,” and be best friends ten minutes later. I dare you to try that as a man.

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#222

Post by Flip-per »

rutierut wrote: post #69
DeusExMachina wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I moved to another country at the age of 30, which meant the number of friends I had dropped to 0. What worked for me was starting dancing tango, where I built a newer, better and larger network than the one I previously had. I guess this can apply to any social activity where you can interact with people, be it social dancing or coocking classes.

This is amazing, it really shows character that you take action to solve your problems and are successful in doing so. So please know that this is not aimed at you personally... But... I am so freaking sick of people recommending others to pickup either salsa or tango! Not of the people that recommend this themselves but are there really no other options? Tango/salsa classes seem to get recommended again, again and a…

> I don't wanna tango :(

What do you want to do?

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#223

Post by jimktrains2 »

Gibbon1 wrote: post #67
thrownaway954 wrote: post #32

Become an alcoholic... Join AA.. Boom!!! More friends than you can imagine :) In all seriousness... I hear this all the time in the rooms... loneliness is a killer. What's crazy is I have a sponsee, who specifically wanted to get sober cause the loneliness was driving him insane. Any reason to get sober and stay is a good reason in my book.

Reminds me I think of a Dilbert strip where Wally takes up smoking so he has an excuse to take breaks and hang out with people.

I used to do non-smoking "smoking" breaks with my smoker friends at work. Why should I be denied 10minutes of non-work every hour or two !

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#224

Post by ancarda »

black_puppydog wrote: post #180

Sorry, I know this will trigger some folks, but this is exactly why I never understood the backlash against "toxic masculinity" that I see from (male) friends whenever the term comes up. Who said it's supposed to be toxic only for others? Being a stereotypically "manly" man would prevent me in particular from expressing some of the things that make me feel the least lonely, from simple things like cooking and being p…

I think it's mostly due to the phrase "toxic masculinity"; it's far too easy to misunderstand it as "masculinity is toxic" - and it doesn't help when someone asks for examples; stuff like stoicism and strength can come up. These aren't toxic. I've also spoken to people who actually believe independence (and wanting to be independent) is toxic.

As this is mostly a branding problem, I want to say I recently came across the phrase "Man Box"[1]. That might be a better phrase to use?

[1] Example: https://mindfulmasculinity.com/blog/manbox

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#225

Post by thrower123 »

theferalrobot wrote: post #20

I just switched from a job where I could work from home anytime I wanted (which meant everyone on my team did so 100% of the time) to a job that requires everyone to be in the office 90% of the time because I want more face-to-face human interaction in my life. The convenience was great but, on the whole, it made me less happy.

I've had the complete opposite experience. For a while, I was in a situation where I went into the office one or two days a week, and worked from home the rest of the time - now I work from home one day a week, sometimes not at all.

It's made me really, really hate dealing with other people, and when I go home, I want to go out in the woods or work in my garage or basement, completely, blessedly alone.

Human interaction is great if it is voluntary and purposeful, but when it is just a shitty default constant, it's a prison.

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#226

Post by chrisseaton »

icebraining wrote: post #190
PeterStuer wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not just the US. 10 hour workdays (officially 7.8, but if you would actually 'just' do that and skip the 8am or the 6pm meetings you will not be keeping up with the Joneses and pay the piper) and spend 2-3 hours in commuting each day doesn't leave much for hobbies.

Meetings outside the working hours?! Where is this common? Here we work 9-6, but even in the places I've worked on where unpaid overtime was common (otherwise you wouldn't keep up with the workload), no manager would have the gall to schedule regular meetings outside working hours.

> Meetings outside the working hours?! Where is this common?

If you have people in, for example, London and San Francisco, how can you possibly have a meeting inside both people's 9-5 working hours?

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#227

Post by tonystubblebine »

Ixiaus wrote: post #212
Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That means you can invite yourself over It is fairly common for a man to marry a woman who does not like his friends. Then, the wife does not want the husband’s friends at their home. So, you cannot invite yourself over, and the man is so busy with giving his wife sufficient attention and with childraising that he cannot easily go out to meet his friends in another location.

It is not common and if you experience this then you are: bad at setting your own boundaries, bad at mate selection, or bad at friend selection. Men are not victims here. Have a hard look at why you think this and fix the problem.

Definitely. A lot of people in these threads seem stuck when they aren't actually stuck. Not particularly surprising since that's all people all the time at least somewhere in their lives. But always worth reminding people that they have agency. Decent first stop if you are in patterns with your mate that make them out to be the enemy would be the book Crucial Conversations. A better first step would be therapy for yourself, followed by couples therapy. It's achievable to have a relationship where "I want X, how can we make this happen together?" is not a fraught conversation. Maybe the answer is an easy yes. Maybe the answer is that you need to bargain, offering something to get something. Maybe the answer is that your one friend is a jerk, but your other friend would be a welcome and hilarious guest. But nothing in that conversation should be scary if you put in a little bit of work on yourself and your relationship.

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#228

Post by whateveracct »

enraged_camel wrote: post #196
whateveracct wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assuming your marriage lasts forever is kind of the point. It's an existential leap-of-faith.

You or your partner will die at some point, and your marriage will end then, right? What happens after that?

That's a personal question that you can't really answer until you're at that point.

But I don't think that has much effect on the marriage itself. If that is how it ends, then the marriage truly did last "forever" in a way :)

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#229

Post by [deleted] »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #206
tonystubblebine wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An important post-30 strategy that I use is to assume that all friends with children are prisoners in their own home. You know exactly where they are. You know they don't have plans. They are desperate for adult conversation. That means you can invite yourself over, bring takeout, and basically make their day. I'm coupled but this should work as a single. Our parent friends say it's actually easier to be friends with…

> That means you can invite yourself over It is fairly common for a man to marry a woman who does not like his friends. Then, the wife does not want the husband’s friends at their home. So, you cannot invite yourself over, and the man is so busy with giving his wife sufficient attention and with childraising that he cannot easily go out to meet his friends in another location.

[deleted]

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#230

Post by Mediterraneo10 »

tonystubblebine wrote: post #227
Ixiaus wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not common and if you experience this then you are: bad at setting your own boundaries, bad at mate selection, or bad at friend selection. Men are not victims here. Have a hard look at why you think this and fix the problem.

Definitely. A lot of people in these threads seem stuck when they aren't actually stuck. Not particularly surprising since that's all people all the time at least somewhere in their lives. But always worth reminding people that they have agency. Decent first stop if you are in patterns with your mate that make them out to be the enemy would be the book Crucial Conversations. A better first step would be therapy for y…

> Decent first stop if you are in patterns with your mate that make them out to be the enemy would be the book Crucial Conversations.

It is not necessarily a case of the husband considering his wife the enemy. It may well be that the husband is content enough with his marriage and parenthood that he simply accepts the wife’s dislike of having his friends over and other obstacles to socializing. Rather, the group that suffers from this circumstance is his former friends.

If you remain single, a noticeable part of the gradual loss of old friends in adulthood – as mentioned by others in this discussion – is your longtime friends getting married and then no longer being unable to maintain the friendship from their end. Obviously you cannot dictate to your friend and your friend’s spouse, and the onus is on you to look elsewhere for other sources of a social life, but it is natural to mourn the loss of a longtime friendship.

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