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United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

justice.gov

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Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#331

Post by koolba »

kchamplewski wrote: post #222
beardog wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and now neither you nor anyone else who reads this comment are able to properly serve on the jury

I'd be curious to see an explanation of why just knowing about jury nullification would disqualify you from being on a jury - obviously if you intend to nullify or "helpfully" inform the other jurors about nullification you should disclose it and therefore be disqualified, but I do not see how knowledge of nullification counts as something that should disqualify you if you have no intention of nullifying.

There’s generally very loose discretion to eliminate potential jurors. Often without providing any reason at all.

A prosecutor, given the option and knowledge of the situation, would never willingly have a person on the jury that knows they could totally disregard the criminality of the charges at hand.

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#332

Post by cwkoss »

elhudy wrote: post #315
cwkoss wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Snowdens most fundamental job requirement was to uphold the US constitution. He tried to stop gross constitutional violations from within using the official processes and was ignored. He is the greatest American hero of our era for sacrificing his own freedom to protect the nation. The NSA employees who are 'just following orders' are little better than Nazi footsolders in 1940s Germany. Their continued violation of…

That can be said in regards to leaks pertaining to constitutional violations against US citizens. But how about the unrelated cyber espionage and surveillance leaks which fell into the hands of China, Russia, etc.? There are only a handful of truly knowledgeable parties in the U.S. which can measure how extensive the damage to those affairs was. It's very easy to say there should be no surveillance whatsoever but tha…

Can you be specific about which leaks to China or Russia concern you?

Of the "handful of truly knowledgeable parties", most/all of them likely are willing to lie to the American public to avoid treason and illegal wiretapping charges for their constitutional violations.

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#333

Post by lern_too_spel »

behringer wrote: post #50
bb88 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're an originalist (and I'm not saying that I am), data in transmit is not necessarily protected by that amendment If your data has left your house, is it really your data, or is it Google's say?

Edward Snowden showed us that the NSA can and does access our webcams remotely. So they are watching you even when you don't know your data is leaving your house.

Where "our webcams" are the webcams of non-US citizens outside the US who are of interest to national security.

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#334

Post by mirimir »

espeed wrote: post #300
markjenkinswpg wrote: post #198

Somebody tell the Donald that Snowden stood up to Obama era policy.

Trust between US tech and the @DeptofDefense is what got burned down. Trust is key. There has been a concerted effort to break that trust to weaken the US position. The US is more resilient than that, and tech is smart enough to see through it. DoD will restore trust. It's time.

Although the DoD (or War Department, as it was originally called) is part of the Executive Branch, it (for the most part) operates only outside the country. And military intelligence (for the most part) operates outside normal government constraints.

That's how it's always been, throughout recorded history. If you constrain military intelligence too much, as happened in the US between WWI and WWII, and during the 90s, you get fuckups like Pearl Harbor and 9/11.

But on the other hand, if military intelligence (and the military generally) operates too much domestically, then you have (doh) a military government. So it's a delicate balance.

As far as I can tell, the US does not have a military government. However, as we saw from documents released from Snowden's cache, the military does operate too much domestically. It's arguably mainly about terrorism and the drug war. But although there are certainly impacts on civil liberties, especially on some ethnic groups, at least there's apparently not much outright suppression of political and social dissidents. So that's reassuring.

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#335

Post by aldoushuxley001 »

SomeOldThrow wrote: post #291
justinmchase wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can he stop this without inviting criticisms of being a Russian asset or some such accusation?

The criticisms will occur at this point no matter what he does. I would actually bet he welcomes the talk as a distraction from his easy to prosecute crimes.

What crimes has Donald committed?

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#336

Post by AviationAtom »

eternalny1 wrote: post #323
cwkoss wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Snowdens most fundamental job requirement was to uphold the US constitution. He tried to stop gross constitutional violations from within using the official processes and was ignored. He is the greatest American hero of our era for sacrificing his own freedom to protect the nation. The NSA employees who are 'just following orders' are little better than Nazi footsolders in 1940s Germany. Their continued violation of…

Since this Hacker News, there is actually a glimmer of hope that the NSA guys in TAO and other areas may read these comments. In that case I would urge them to think about what they are doing, and what Snowden revealed. SIGINT is important, but showing PowerPoint slides with an image of a virus doing the "happy dance" IS NOT. That is teenage hacker nonsense, which makes me believe they do not care one iota about what…

They do read HN, but you'd be hard pressed to find one that shares your view, as they have insights that you and others outside the IC do not. Despite being on the inside Snowden lacked that insight. There are not enough resources to keep tabs on the foreign terrorists, let alone random Americans, or even random XYZ country people. It is not a free for all in the NSA, there are many restrictions and protections on what people can do, how they can do it, and who they can do it to.

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#339

Post by peteretep »

cwkoss wrote: post #310
elhudy wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Snowden "...carefully evaluated every single document I disclosed to ensure that each was legitimately in the public interest. There are all sorts of documents that would have made a big impact that I didn't turn over" What was released (and how), and what we learned are two separate issues. As a U.S. citizen, it's preferable that the subjective legitimacy of what best serves public interest is not in the hands of ON…

Snowdens most fundamental job requirement was to uphold the US constitution. He tried to stop gross constitutional violations from within using the official processes and was ignored. He is the greatest American hero of our era for sacrificing his own freedom to protect the nation. The NSA employees who are 'just following orders' are little better than Nazi footsolders in 1940s Germany. Their continued violation of…

> Snowdens most fundamental job requirement was to uphold the US constitution

This feels like one of those things that Americans say, that may not be true. Is this actually true? Do NSA employees state such an oath? Is defense of the constitution more important than defense of the nation if the two are in conflict?

Happy to be persuaded that this is true, but feels pretty glib to a non-American.

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#340

Post by skyyler »

burtonator wrote: post #252
justinmchase wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can he stop this without inviting criticisms of being a Russian asset or some such accusation?

He could probably help with these accusations by releasing his tax returns. :)

I don't follow US politics. How would that help? Legitimate question.
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