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France and Germany Agree to Block Facebook's Libra

reuters.com

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Re: France and Germany Agree to Block Facebook's Libra

#771

Post by lostjohnny »

nugget wrote: post #575
dpau wrote: post #419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Last week I wanted to purchase a used item but discovered that, without warning or notification, Marketplace was deactivated from my Facebook account. My Facebook account is quite active, with posts, discussion in multiple groups, and hundreds of friends. I still have no clue as to what rule I triggered and no recourse to reactivate it. Now imagine that's my digital Libra bank account? No thanks.

Isn't the answer better consumer protections, though? Rather than a ban on new technology that threatens the status quo. If Facebook wants to be a bank, they should be subject to the banking regulators and there could be (should be) strong consumer protections preventing the type of corporate behavior you describe.

Yes.

They can.

In Euros.

Thanks.

p.s.: they are already applying for it, PSD2 regulation allows them to emit cards or be intermediaries for payments.

No foreign fake, unregulated, privately conrolled currencies here in Europe, thank you.

Re: France and Germany Agree to Block Facebook's Libra

#772

Post by lostjohnny »

Zak wrote: post #572
WhoBeI wrote: post #522

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was hoping this would happen. It will probably become a EU thing now. The idea of a privately controlled currency needs to die quickly. Never been a fan of crypto currency in general but Bitcoin, and the like, are accepted because they are not centralized. Your Bitcoin won't change in value or disappear because your country and another get in a fight.

I'm quite fond of the idea of a decentralized currency that nobody has the ability to actively control becoming popular. That would act as a hedge against abuse of power by both governments and corporations. A currency used worldwide, controlled by a corporation, and under the influence of the US government would be the exact opposite, and is not a thing I want to see succeed.

> nobody has the ability to actively control

AKA only the really powerful entities can

AKA "dictatorship"

Re: France and Germany Agree to Block Facebook's Libra

#773

Post by lostjohnny »

smsm42 wrote: post #550
WhoBeI wrote: post #522

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was hoping this would happen. It will probably become a EU thing now. The idea of a privately controlled currency needs to die quickly. Never been a fan of crypto currency in general but Bitcoin, and the like, are accepted because they are not centralized. Your Bitcoin won't change in value or disappear because your country and another get in a fight.

There are lots of privately controlled currencies. Miles, points, certificates, game gold, etc. - they are all private currencies. Most of them aren't legal tender, but neither are cryptocurrencies. The only difference between facebook-coin and miles is that Facebook promises to encourage dealing in their coin and airline would frown on that. Not much difference otherwise. You have some tokens that you can exchange f…

You don't buy food with miles.

You win cookware sets.

The best you can do to convert them in money is to trade them, but to obtain them you still have to buy them or flight for real (proof of work IRL)

But there's no largest marketplace on earth, controlled by a single company, where you can spend them.

Re: France and Germany Agree to Block Facebook's Libra

#774

Post by lostjohnny »

buboard wrote: post #486
jayd16 wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then create a bank. But that's not what this is. They want to make a bank that prints its own currency and skips the paperwork needed for current monetary exchange. It's just as OP has said.

Libra is meant to be safer and better than a bank. Seems almost impossible to fail, it has 100% reserve backing while banks have < 2% in europe. It supports instant payments even in the most remote regions of the eart. It will be a terrible competitor for banks, if it works. The problem is that it s backed by a conglomerate that is too big to trust.

> It supports instant payments even in the most remote regions of the eart

no, they don't.

still need an internet connection and two person with a libra account.

Anyway, you can do the same thing with paypal...

Re: France and Germany Agree to Block Facebook's Libra

#775

Post by lostjohnny »

bko wrote: post #361
lostlogin wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ll stick to using my money as money thanks. It works fine.

I'm glad that you live in a country with a stable monetary supply, little to no inflation and no capital controls.

and the solution is "let facebook be your central bank and currency supplier"?

Re: France and Germany Agree to Block Facebook's Libra

#776

Post by lostjohnny »

tannhaeuser wrote: post #268
blackbrokkoli wrote: post #225

I'm of course not familiar with the specific mindsets and the history of this decision, but I want to share a bit of cultural perspective from Germany that is so far not really considered in this comment section: Germany is very, very keen on preventing powerful entities from acting outside of regulation and similarly, if not more, on preventing a single entity to get in control of everything. This is largely due to…

> not familiar with the specific mindsets and the history of this decision I think Monsieur Macron has put this onto the agenda when Libra was announced. I'm not disagreeing with the decision and have similar concerns as you, but I'm still uncertain whether the state should even have the ability to block these and other things in general. Most of all, I miss a British voice here (as, sadly, not very much longer an EU…

> as, sadly, not very much longer an EU member

it could have been a better, less irrational, EU partner (it was never a full member)

Re: France and Germany Agree to Block Facebook's Libra

#777

Post by lostjohnny »

erikpukinskis wrote: post #731
scoobyyabbadoo wrote: post #724

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please assume good faith and discuss the topics directly. What is it that you find debatable about my comment? I've always made good faith efforts at productive conversation whether someone agrees or disagrees with me on something

“Assume good faith” doesn’t mean “ignore evidence of bad faith”.

let it go.

HN mods are not here for justice, they'll never admit they are wrong.

Re: France and Germany Agree to Block Facebook's Libra

#778

Post by lostjohnny »

squiggleblaz wrote: post #770
erikpukinskis wrote: post #742

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, I will try to unpack my thoughts. You go after Jewish people as a class, rather than specific institutions controlled by Jewish people, which I think is bad faith argumentation. If you criticized Israel, for example, or some specific set of banks I would be ok with that. I admit I would not have the same reaction against another person criticizing “white people” as a class. But I believe I am justified in that…

With respect, and despite being completely off topic: > But I believe I am justified in that because whiteness is not an ethnicity, it is the practice of denial of ethnicity. I fundamentally do not understand what that means. Surely I don't have a choice but to be white? What am I denying? It's true that whiteness is not an ethnicity, since Russians and white Americans are surely ethnically distinct - more so, I thin…

> since Russians and white Americans are surely ethnically distinct

Are you an anthroplogist?

I bet not.

Many white Americans have slavic blood just like russians.

Re: France and Germany Agree to Block Facebook's Libra

#779

Post by lostjohnny »

wyattpeak wrote: post #616
throwaway744678 wrote: post #547

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That, my friend, is very close to a Godwin point. Let's be careful here.

The original comment is about German attitudes towards the accumulation of power, which are a direct product of their experiences with Nazism. Germans don't want uncontrolled groups accumulating power precisely because it could lead to a situation like Nazi Germany. Once Godwin's law became a meme it outlived its usefulness. Yes, people tend to hyperbolically compare things to the Nazis. But the Nazis were a real thi…

> But the Nazis were a real thing that happened in the real world

not because of inflation though.

if you wanna be historically accurate.

Re: France and Germany Agree to Block Facebook's Libra

#780

Post by lostjohnny »

repolfx wrote: post #671
wyattpeak wrote: post #616

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The original comment is about German attitudes towards the accumulation of power, which are a direct product of their experiences with Nazism. Germans don't want uncontrolled groups accumulating power precisely because it could lead to a situation like Nazi Germany. Once Godwin's law became a meme it outlived its usefulness. Yes, people tend to hyperbolically compare things to the Nazis. But the Nazis were a real thi…

I agree with the rest of your points, but: Germans don't want uncontrolled groups accumulating power precisely because it could lead to a situation like Nazi Germany Uh huh. Really. Germans totally hate uncontrollable groups trying to take over Europe? Please spare me sanctimonious Germans claiming some sort of moral high ground they don't have. In fact from a British perspective it appears Germany has learned nothin…

> In fact from a British perspective it appears

that you brits are wrong.

300 millions EU citizens know that.

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