Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Khashoggi children have received houses in Saudi Arabia and monthly payments

washingtonpost.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 69 posts

Re: Khashoggi children have received houses in Saudi Arabia and monthly payments

#51

Post by not_a_cop75 »

alistproducer2 wrote: post #49
not_a_cop75 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should really define shitty. What you are saying is you don't particularly like a country without the ability to actually describe why that is. It's comes off feeling like someone's opinion of their favorite sports team. Certainly, the countries you like do things differently than the ones you want, but you won't even highlight those differences. No, instead it's only bad and good. I'm frankly tired of people tha…

What part of instigated coups on behalf of a fruit company and illegally killing people I'm Venezuela is unclear? Cause I literally typed those things in my parent comment. Those seem to me to be valid reasons for having issues with a government. It's ironic that a comment trying to persuade others to "get creative" is the comment that seems suspiciously like copypasta.

So you point to one incident to prove everything that exists about a country must be wrong? How does that logically work? Was there corruption? Yes. Which government doesn't have corruption. Tell me if you know.

Well, telling people to hate a country on the basis one one corrupt incident sounds suspiciously like IDF to me. If you think corruption is an issue, then why don't you do something about it, instead of whining that it's bad?

Re: Khashoggi children have received houses in Saudi Arabia and monthly payments

#52

Post by analog31 »

alistproducer2 wrote: post #45
patthebunny wrote: post #12

Well that's nice. Totally makes up for a theocratic dictator having their father chopped up. I guess they have no choice but to just accept it, because of the same dictator. Can't believe this shitty government is our "ally". Fuck the Saudi Government.

In order to be legitimately upset with our government having"shitty allies", you first need to believe in the fiction that our government isn't shitty itself. A quick browse through history should relieve of such a fantasy. In fact you don't need to look at history. The policy of illegal sanctions begun under the last administration, and now the illegal blockade of Venezuela (which is resulting in the deaths of many…

My government doesn't reflect on me. I'll protest any government that I disapprove of.

Re: Khashoggi children have received houses in Saudi Arabia and monthly payments

#53

Post by carapace »

not_a_cop75 wrote: post #51
alistproducer2 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What part of instigated coups on behalf of a fruit company and illegally killing people I'm Venezuela is unclear? Cause I literally typed those things in my parent comment. Those seem to me to be valid reasons for having issues with a government. It's ironic that a comment trying to persuade others to "get creative" is the comment that seems suspiciously like copypasta.

So you point to one incident to prove everything that exists about a country must be wrong? How does that logically work? Was there corruption? Yes. Which government doesn't have corruption. Tell me if you know. Well, telling people to hate a country on the basis one one corrupt incident sounds suspiciously like IDF to me. If you think corruption is an issue, then why don't you do something about it, instead of whini…

Are you getting in a pissing contest about how many shitty things the US Government has done? Because, let me tell you, that is a contest you are going to lose.

I consider myself a patriot, but I don't think that means I should be blind to the errors of my nation, my government. On the contrary, it's hard but important to look clearly at our mistakes, to learn from them and hopefully not repeat them.

Re: Khashoggi children have received houses in Saudi Arabia and monthly payments

#54

Post by alistproducer2 »

not_a_cop75 wrote: post #51
alistproducer2 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What part of instigated coups on behalf of a fruit company and illegally killing people I'm Venezuela is unclear? Cause I literally typed those things in my parent comment. Those seem to me to be valid reasons for having issues with a government. It's ironic that a comment trying to persuade others to "get creative" is the comment that seems suspiciously like copypasta.

So you point to one incident to prove everything that exists about a country must be wrong? How does that logically work? Was there corruption? Yes. Which government doesn't have corruption. Tell me if you know. Well, telling people to hate a country on the basis one one corrupt incident sounds suspiciously like IDF to me. If you think corruption is an issue, then why don't you do something about it, instead of whini…

"point to one incident" so I pointed out two things and clearly allude that if one does the research, you'll find many more than two things (Iranian revolution is an easy one).

"telling people to hate a country" the word hate never appears once in my comment. Again, you seem to be "responding" to some generalization of a viewpoint you don't like instead of what is actually on your screen. No disrespect but I don't really see any reason to continue to respond to you when you are making no effort to respond to what I'm actually writing.

Re: Khashoggi children have received houses in Saudi Arabia and monthly payments

#55

Post by wahern »

mcny wrote: post #35
rolltiide wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Financial compensation is an Islamic cleric and state compliant way to resolve deaths over there. Of course you can read the book one thousand different ways. The point is that it is nice they fulfilled that promise. edit: remember, their religious clerics can say whatever they want and thats the law in a theocracy. English wikipedia is not going to describe that adequately

> The point is that it is nice they fulfilled that promise. In a free society, I'd have asked for for MBS' life under retributive justice. I wouldn't want him killed, just would want a much fairer diya (double digit share of Aramco?). The Wikipedia article says https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diya_(Islam) > It only applies when victim's family want to compromise with the guilty party; otherwise qisas applies.

But it's not a free society. It's not only an Islamic society (a very distinct kind, with scriptural exegesis not lifted from Wikipedia), but an absolute monarchy as well.

From a humanistic standpoint, the assassination was abhorrent. From an international politics and international law standpoint, intolerable. From the standpoint of a recently elevated absolute ruler suppressing dissent, diligent.

As the previous poster said, at least they're paying benefits, even though it's all part of the cover up. From a Western, guilt-based moralist standpoint such benefits can seem like a slap in the face. From a Middle Eastern, honor-based moralist standpoint, it's the decent thing to do, regardless of what precipitated it.

Re: Khashoggi children have received houses in Saudi Arabia and monthly payments

#56

Post by wahern »

option wrote: post #18
chrisco255 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's 195 countries on the planet. You want to go to war with every single one whose leaders have people arbitrarily killed...you'd need to go to war with most of them, including the United States itself.

while your statement is technically true, the sa is the most disgusting state in the world. IMHO ideologically even farther from western democracies then north korea is

I find that statement ridiculous. Saudi Arabia is a theocratic society with an absolute monarch. The things that occur there may seem abhorrent, but they follow relatively strict norms. Capricious things occur, but even the monarch responds to internal political and cultural pressures in service to a nominally higher authority.

North Korea is ruled by the capricious whim of a single person who makes the rules as he goes along, and whose decisions have led to multiple famines and other atrocities resulting in the deaths of millions of North Koreans, still ongoing. And Kim Jong-un doesn't need a cover up when he assassinates someone; he's a god incarnate.

Have a little perspective. It's easier to criticize Saudi Arabia precisely because it's more like Western society than North Korea, even if that similarity is often illusory.

Re: Khashoggi children have received houses in Saudi Arabia and monthly payments

#57

Post by not_a_cop75 »

carapace wrote: post #53
not_a_cop75 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you point to one incident to prove everything that exists about a country must be wrong? How does that logically work? Was there corruption? Yes. Which government doesn't have corruption. Tell me if you know. Well, telling people to hate a country on the basis one one corrupt incident sounds suspiciously like IDF to me. If you think corruption is an issue, then why don't you do something about it, instead of whini…

Are you getting in a pissing contest about how many shitty things the US Government has done? Because, let me tell you, that is a contest you are going to lose. I consider myself a patriot, but I don't think that means I should be blind to the errors of my nation, my government. On the contrary, it's hard but important to look clearly at our mistakes, to learn from them and hopefully not repeat them.

Are you getting in a pissing contest to figure out if the US government has done more wrong things than right things? Because if so, you are going to lose.

Good luck practicing open and honestly blatantly hostile criticism of political figures in any other country. Even Europe has squashed things like memes to keep the public from realizing the truth.

You're not a patriot. You are a wanna be.

People are wrong and corrupt. Governments by and large can only do what we allow them to do. They are simply an amplification of the people underneath it all that are in charge.

If you think countries that help companies in their borders are wrong, you're going to have a really hard time with countries that openly steal from and abuse their citizens.

You think that the US isn't perfect, Possibly you're right. Tell me about your paradise now. Tell me who is perfect? The reality is that every country optimizes for different things. Which country do you think optimizes the best? Have you been able to find a job there you like, pays you well enough, and to move there? If so, great. If not, maybe there's a reason for that? Maybe you really like the X of one country and the Y of another because the X and Y are those things those countries have optimized best for.

Re: Khashoggi children have received houses in Saudi Arabia and monthly payments

#58

Post by carapace »

not_a_cop75 wrote: post #57
carapace wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you getting in a pissing contest about how many shitty things the US Government has done? Because, let me tell you, that is a contest you are going to lose. I consider myself a patriot, but I don't think that means I should be blind to the errors of my nation, my government. On the contrary, it's hard but important to look clearly at our mistakes, to learn from them and hopefully not repeat them.

Are you getting in a pissing contest to figure out if the US government has done more wrong things than right things? Because if so, you are going to lose. Good luck practicing open and honestly blatantly hostile criticism of political figures in any other country. Even Europe has squashed things like memes to keep the public from realizing the truth. You're not a patriot. You are a wanna be. People are wrong and cor…

I am a patriot, as in I love this country and would, if called, give up my very life for it. God Bless America.

One of the things I love about the US of A is our freedom of speech. We can talk openly about things like how our nation is founded on genocide and slavery, and being able and willing to do that is an essential part of overcoming our faults and atoning for our sins.

What are we even arguing about? Whether the US government is "shitty" or not? I would say it's too big: some shitty and some sublime, the totality beyond human comprehension.

Red White and Blue.

Brahma Vishnu Shiva

Re: Khashoggi children have received houses in Saudi Arabia and monthly payments

#59

Post by inflatableDodo »

carapace wrote: post #53
not_a_cop75 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you point to one incident to prove everything that exists about a country must be wrong? How does that logically work? Was there corruption? Yes. Which government doesn't have corruption. Tell me if you know. Well, telling people to hate a country on the basis one one corrupt incident sounds suspiciously like IDF to me. If you think corruption is an issue, then why don't you do something about it, instead of whini…

Are you getting in a pissing contest about how many shitty things the US Government has done? Because, let me tell you, that is a contest you are going to lose. I consider myself a patriot, but I don't think that means I should be blind to the errors of my nation, my government. On the contrary, it's hard but important to look clearly at our mistakes, to learn from them and hopefully not repeat them.

>Are you getting in a pissing contest about how many shitty things the US Government has done? Because, let me tell you, that is a contest you are going to lose.

Hi from the UK. I think we are still in the running. Mind you, we did have a head start.

Re: Khashoggi children have received houses in Saudi Arabia and monthly payments

#60

Post by dang »

patthebunny wrote: post #12

Well that's nice. Totally makes up for a theocratic dictator having their father chopped up. I guess they have no choice but to just accept it, because of the same dictator. Can't believe this shitty government is our "ally". Fuck the Saudi Government.

Can you please stop posting unsubstantive and/or flamebaity comments to HN? I'm afraid you've already done it a lot, and it's not what HN is for. As you'll see if you review the site guidelines, we're trying for something a bit better than internet default here.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Post reply on HN