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India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon

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121–130 of 297 posts

Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon

#121
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"We choose to go to the moon. We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win, and the others, too." It's mostly a matter of cons…

For what it's worth, many of the impacts don't seem to be well-reported in popular media. Consider this 2013 NASA report[0] on its socio-economic impacts: an IMPLAN input/output analysis shows NASA directly generates $2.60 of economic output per dollar spent, compared to the federal non-military average of $2.30 and military average of $2.00. This often-quoted 1975 paper[1] posits a 14:1 increase in GNP resulting fro…

I agree that from purely economical standpoint NASA research has paid for itself.

But I must note how none of the benefits came from any of the lofty predictions coming true: colonizing other worlds, etc.

If anything we found out that we cannot colonize anything, NASA research gave us cheap flying, globalization of commerce that we now use to negatively impact the Earth ... in the end, instead of giving us a new world, it is making us lose the one we have.

Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon

#122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your post has "false dichotomy" written all over it. Of course, space exploration is an international endeavor and most space missions are highly international. Planning international space exploration missions doesn't force anyone to give up their nation, just as global trade does not imply that. Moreover, if mankind ever expands into space, it would be rather naive to think that earth's nations would play a role th…

> With a federal structure, it would be no problem. In fact, you don't even have to look beyond India to see a country which is doing pretty well for itself (all things considered) despite each state being a quasi nation with distinct cultural and language mores.

India, which is currently stripping ethnic Bangladeshis of citizenship? That India?

Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon

#123

I'm for space programs, but India is one of the poorest countries on earth, and spending that kind of money on social programs would actually have an impact on it's population. And then it looks like it failed on top of that, which is honestly not surprising, since space programs are so sensitive to minor quality issues and quality is the hardest thing for a 3rd world country. If I was living in India and struggling…

1 in 8 households in America was food insecure in 2017 [1]. Do you think it's justified to spend 20 billion dollars on NASA when America can't even provide food security to each of its residents, and reports of crumbling infrastructure from all corners of the country, from collapsing bridges to cracking dams speak the sorrow tale of construction quality in what is supposed to be a 1st world country?

[1] https://www.feedingamerica.org/about-us/press-room/new-data

Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon

#124
post #105
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would landing from a polar orbit be harder?

I’m no expert but doing polar landing would involve a plane change maneuver after you arrive in moon orbit (or some clever orbital mechanics to minimize delta-v losses and somehow do it in a single burn (both capture and plane change). Apart from that, I’d presume theres also complexity of the landing site not being directly visible from earth, necessitating re-transmissions from the orbiter. Not something that hasn’…

In terms of orbital mechanics the polar orbit around the moon isn't significantly more complicated than an equatorial one. A small midcourse correction after entering a flight path towards the moon is all that's needed to ensure capture into orbit around the poles (and a capture burn), without the need for a plane change (note that this is also based on experience from KSP).

Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon

#125

I'm for space programs, but India is one of the poorest countries on earth, and spending that kind of money on social programs would actually have an impact on it's population. And then it looks like it failed on top of that, which is honestly not surprising, since space programs are so sensitive to minor quality issues and quality is the hardest thing for a 3rd world country. If I was living in India and struggling…

1 in 8 households in America was food insecure in 2017 [1]. Do you think it's justified to spend 20 billion dollars on NASA when America can't even provide food security to each of its residents, and reports of crumbling infrastructure from all corners of the country, from collapsing bridges to cracking dams speak the sorrow tale of construction quality in what is supposed to be a 1st world country? [1] https://www.f…

Or let's take 0.01% from the military budget instead?

Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon

#126
post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m no expert but doing polar landing would involve a plane change maneuver after you arrive in moon orbit (or some clever orbital mechanics to minimize delta-v losses and somehow do it in a single burn (both capture and plane change). Apart from that, I’d presume theres also complexity of the landing site not being directly visible from earth, necessitating re-transmissions from the orbiter. Not something that hasn’…

In terms of orbital mechanics the polar orbit around the moon isn't significantly more complicated than an equatorial one. A small midcourse correction after entering a flight path towards the moon is all that's needed to ensure capture into orbit around the poles (and a capture burn), without the need for a plane change (note that this is also based on experience from KSP).

I see what you mean, though I'm not sure of all the details, you might want to get into an equatorial orbit (there is an orbiter, though I'm not sure about its orbit) just because the error margin is smaller (?) or for some other reason.

(But then of course the moon is neither too far nor too big so I might just be barking at the wrong tree here)

Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon

#127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will disagree with your views, scientifically we are same race and our genetic differences are insignificant. Our ancestors originated in Africa. Indeed today most nation's are a hotpot of multi-culture, language, colors, food etc. All these difference you talk about came from our tribal nationalistic mentality. Indeed the reason USA and many other countries succeeded is due to openness to embrace diversity. Single…

" the reason USA and many other countries succeeded is due to openness to embrace diversity." - I'd say it was due to a combination colonialism of Asia, subjugation of Africa by the slave trade and world wars recking Europe. By 1950s, USA was already ahead of the rest of the world. Because it was in that position that it was able to attract immigrants which then helped to sustain its position. There are many countrie…

>On the other hand, Japan, South Korea, China and Asian tigers have done well without being open and diverse.

They all make money by selling to the USA.

Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon

#128
post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> aside from the Chinese and India Do you know how many different empires, rulers, internal wars and government systems China and India have gone through in 2000 years, and how many "races" and "cultures" they have?

> Do you know how many different empires, rulers, internal wars and government systems China and India have gone through in 2000 years, and how many "races" and "cultures" they have? Yes. Still more homogeneous and stable than most other empires...

Oh you mean like that time when the Mongol conquered and ruled china for like, 100+ years, ushering in the largest case of minority rule the world had ever seen to that point.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuan_dynasty

Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon

#129

Kudos to India for even trying. While they are trying to put a probe on the moon, we have a President going through dementia arguing about a 2 week old weather forecast.

While they are trying to put a probe on the moon??

We sent actual people there 50 years ago! And they did not crash on the moon.

What do these people all have in common? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_who_have_walked...

They are all American.

Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon

#130

Kudos to India for even trying. While they are trying to put a probe on the moon, we have a President going through dementia arguing about a 2 week old weather forecast.

While they are trying to put a probe on the moon?? We sent actual people there 50 years ago! And they did not crash on the moon. What do these people all have in common? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_who_have_walked... They are all American.

50 years ago we walked on the moon. This year we're not. _They_ went to the moon, built the interstate system, subway system, etc. _We_ are barely maintaining what we inherited.
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