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Hong Kong protestors using Bridgefy's Bluetooth-based mesh network messaging app

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Re: Hong Kong protestors using Bridgefy's Bluetooth-based mesh network messaging app

#191

Post by oarsinsync »

phs318u wrote: post #183
oarsinsync wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This only applies to users who have an Apple ID registered as being in China. Hong Kong residents are not impacted by this.

For now. The broader question is, if the Chinese state can demand this, then what (other than popular opinion) is stopping other states (with sufficient clout to meddle in Apple's markets and/or operations) from demanding the same?

Context of the conversation wasn't hypothetical future situations, but rather the present situation facing Hong Kong protesters.

Given that the protests are about China's over-reach into Hong Kong rule of law, Apple making any changes in the immediate future to impact Hong Kong residents would be a very challenging decision to make. It would also be particularly difficult to enforce, given that Hong Kong exists on the outside of the Great Firewall, with the rest of the wider Internet.

Re: Hong Kong protestors using Bridgefy's Bluetooth-based mesh network messaging app

#192

Post by jorgeribs »

whoopdedo wrote: post #187
ukd1 wrote: post #159

The Bridgify ToS are egregious; under "Messaging Content", you grant them irrevocable rights to use your messaging content...

Are there many services that don't ask for this broad scope? I see it often and understand it comes from lawyers studying the business process and writing a contract that enables it within the Kafkaesque copyright laws. They ask for universal copying right because if you spin up a new VM you don't want to have to ask if every message you send to it has permission to be copied to this new instance. And they want it to…

That's exactly why, whoopdedo :)

Re: Hong Kong protestors using Bridgefy's Bluetooth-based mesh network messaging app

#193

Post by jorgeribs »

rcach001 wrote: post #52
jorgeribs wrote: post #46

Hi everybody, I'm Jorge, founder of Bridgefy. Happy to answer any questions!

Hi Jorge, fyi I just browsed for Bridgefy on google and clicked on the first link that showed up and some random page turned up. It looked like it was hacked or something.

Sorry about that! Our official website is indeed www.bridgefy.me, and we should have www.bridgefy.com recovered in a short while.

Re: Hong Kong protestors using Bridgefy's Bluetooth-based mesh network messaging app

#194

Post by jorgeribs »

petre wrote: post #70
Answerawake wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hi Jorge, Pardon my ignorance but lets say that someone runs a typical cell phone jammer in the area, would that block the Bluetooth signal from working or are RF wavelengths not able to be jammed?

They'd have to specifically jam BT or all the public 2.4 Ghz band which includes WiFi and other protocols. Given that a BT jammer can be bought online for less than 100$, it's trivial to block this app over several tens of meters.

Well said petre, that's the perfect answer.

Re: Hong Kong protestors using Bridgefy's Bluetooth-based mesh network messaging app

#195

Post by jorgeribs »

barbs wrote: post #110
jorgeribs wrote: post #46

Hi everybody, I'm Jorge, founder of Bridgefy. Happy to answer any questions!

Hi Jorge, how much does participating in a Bridgefy bluetooth mesh network affect battery life?

Since we use Bluetooth Low Energy and the algorithm works to make broadcasting/forwarding efficient, we've found that running messages for 24 hours consumes around 7-10% battery total on an average device. These numbers may differ depending on the OS, device, usage, etc. but in a nutshell: we don't consider battery consumption to be a problem.

Re: Hong Kong protestors using Bridgefy's Bluetooth-based mesh network messaging app

#196

Post by rolph »

Phlarp wrote: post #112
rolph wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this is why you remove the battery of the burner until you use it. remove the battery and sim of your compromised phone relocate yourself install sim and battery of your burner

This still creates a detectable pattern. If the legit phone goes off while the burner is on that's a pattern. If the legit phone goes off and (travel time / distance) elapses before burner appears (travel time / distance) away from the last legit ping that's a pattern. If the legit phone and burner phone hit the same towers at the same time more than 3 times that's a pattern. If the burner phone spends most of the ti…

the still detectable pattern depends on how often you use your phone or make the switch. its not a pattern if its done over days or if you even leave a phone cached in a special place such as a geocache so it can be swapped by someone else for a different burner.

Re: Hong Kong protestors using Bridgefy's Bluetooth-based mesh network messaging app

#197

Post by klingonopera »

throwaway1997 wrote: post #45
klingonopera wrote: post #5

If worst comes to worst, I hope there's satellite connectivity to HK. Or landlines not under Chinese jurisdiction. EDIT: To clarify, I'm concerned about what could happen if China cuts HK off from the Internet.

China can't cut HK off from the internet. Almost all Chinese internet traffic is routed through Hong Kong, not the other way around.

Wait, so if I in Europe send an email to a Chinese server, it gets routed across the Atlantic, Pacific and via HK into China? There's no direct land link?

Re: Hong Kong protestors using Bridgefy's Bluetooth-based mesh network messaging app

#198

Post by trevyn »

phs318u wrote: post #146
cwyers wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think China getting that information from Apple is sort of a second-order concern at this point. In a more stable situation, yeah, you don't want the police to have a reason to knock on your door. When you're gearing up to go protest in public and the cops are dropping tear gas on everybody, those sorts of lists are less important. Not saying that it doesn't matter, but there is no such thing as absolute security,…

Keep in mind that Apple's iCloud services in China are not actually provided by Apple. They are provided by Cloud Big Data Industrial Development Co., Ltd., and allows Apple to, "continue to improve iCloud services in China mainland and comply with Chinese regulations". [0] This service even has different terms of service, than the standard iCloud offering (though I haven't done a diff to see what's changed). The eff…

The company name is actually "Guizhou on the Cloud Big Data Industrial Development Co., Ltd."

(I thought that was a joke/parody name, but it's actually true.)

Re: Hong Kong protestors using Bridgefy's Bluetooth-based mesh network messaging app

#199

Post by aramova »

dingo_bat wrote: post #84
busterarm wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Satellite phones are extremely easy to determine point of origin, give or take 20m. That's enough to dispatch police or worse, launch an airstrike.

I doubt China is planning to airstrile individual protestor.

Like people doubted they'd run over a protester with a tank, right?

Re: Hong Kong protestors using Bridgefy's Bluetooth-based mesh network messaging app

#200

Post by busterarm »

anigbrowl wrote: post #138
busterarm wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This tactic has been used a number of times that I'm aware of, in Eastern Europe, South America and the Middle East.

Surprising given how easily defeatable it is for anyone sufficiently motivated.

The only "easily defeatable" method that I'm aware of is to make your call from somewhere you don't mind being bombed, make it from a place with multiple egress points, and to stay on the call for at most 90 seconds.

Or put an optical repeater at your target (bombable) site and install a long run of fiber to your safe location, which you then have to abandon. Doesn't seem very practical to me.

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