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H-1B Visa Most Used for 'Software Engineer,' 'Software Developer' Roles

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Re: H-1B Visa Most Used for 'Software Engineer,' 'Software Developer' Roles

#21
post #8

I might previously have argued that H-1Bs were causing a domino effect on the rest of US employment - their complete inability to negotiate higher salaries spilled over into the rest of the industry. However, I see now that such an argument is shortsighted. There is no evidence outside of my own conjecture to support such a thing and my frustration with my own experiences in the industry is causing me to scapegoat H-…

As someone who worked in the US with a H1-B, in my case it was because you'd not find someone with my particular skill at that point in time. I was also paid more than the employees at the company I was contracted to work at - because of my particular skill and I'd taken a pay cut to move to the US. This is what the H1-B is/was supposed to be like. It does seem that it has been abused.

> in my case it was because you'd not find someone with my particular skill at that point in time.

That's how the program is sold and it's incredibly easy to game. Require 10 years of Swift experience and suddenly the candidate pool is dry. Generally most, if not all, IT job postings list an unrealistic and fictitious skill set.

> I was also paid more than the employees at the company I was contracted to work at

The cost of a Full-time Employee is usually something like 140-160% of their salary. So a contractor making 120% more than an FTE is still cheaper for the employer.

Re: H-1B Visa Most Used for 'Software Engineer,' 'Software Developer' Roles

#22
post #8

I might previously have argued that H-1Bs were causing a domino effect on the rest of US employment - their complete inability to negotiate higher salaries spilled over into the rest of the industry. However, I see now that such an argument is shortsighted. There is no evidence outside of my own conjecture to support such a thing and my frustration with my own experiences in the industry is causing me to scapegoat H-…

>There is no evidence outside of my own conjecture to support such a thing

Every economist believes in supply and demand curves. If there are any H1Bs being awarded to replaceable programmers (as opposed to specialized programmers with no American counterparts, as was the intended use of the system), then wages are being depressed. It's practically a law of physics.

Re: H-1B Visa Most Used for 'Software Engineer,' 'Software Developer' Roles

#23
post #11

This article is comparing the average salary of junior engineers (because H-1B employees tend to be junior, they move off of H-1B into green cards after a few years) with the average salary of software engineers as a whole.

> they move off of H-1B into green cards after a few years

In theory, not in practice.

Re: H-1B Visa Most Used for 'Software Engineer,' 'Software Developer' Roles

#24
post #11

This article is comparing the average salary of junior engineers (because H-1B employees tend to be junior, they move off of H-1B into green cards after a few years) with the average salary of software engineers as a whole.

> "H-1B employees tend to be junior"

You do realize that this generalization can't possibly be true?

H-1B are reserved for "highly skilled immigrants" carrying out skilled work. You won't find kitchen staff, taxi drivers or librarians on H-1Bs. As a company, junior engineers simply aren't worth the time and effort that comes with sponsoring H-1Bs. Software isn't an "ass in seat" industry - sponsoring juniors simply isn't worth it.

Re: H-1B Visa Most Used for 'Software Engineer,' 'Software Developer' Roles

#25
IMO, H1Bs should be given out via action style based on salary where the highest bidders (companies that need to fill the positions) get them. That's the only simple way to make sure they are not trying to replace higher cost US workers with lower cost H1B workers who are beholden to their employers every whim over threat of being kicked out.

Re: H-1B Visa Most Used for 'Software Engineer,' 'Software Developer' Roles

#26
post #19
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What other artificial employment barriers do you advocate removing? They may not all be just or implemented particularly well, but I think there are some (e.g., child labour, work-health standards, etc.) that make sure the economy is serving society and not the other way around.

Having to go through a lottery based visa system to work?

I know you're not the parent commenter, but is your issue with the intent of the policy (presumably, to manage immigration) or with the implementation of said policy (via a lottery based system)?

Re: H-1B Visa Most Used for 'Software Engineer,' 'Software Developer' Roles

#27
post #8

I might previously have argued that H-1Bs were causing a domino effect on the rest of US employment - their complete inability to negotiate higher salaries spilled over into the rest of the industry. However, I see now that such an argument is shortsighted. There is no evidence outside of my own conjecture to support such a thing and my frustration with my own experiences in the industry is causing me to scapegoat H-…

The reality that is not going to be well received by people here is that you don't seem to understand that the H1B visa is not some exercise in globalist altruism for foreigners over native people in their own homes; it is a ruse, a scam to masquerade the wealth pillage by the ruling class from their own nature middle and working class, by driving down wages and salaries, while also using it to cover up the reality that they are utterly illegitimate and incompetent rulers that did not adequately mange the country and resources to produce the supply of workers they would have needed to meet the demand domestically.

What that translates to the H1B loving crowd here, is that the second the H1B visa and all the other ponzi scheme tactics are no longer profitable to the ruling elite, like if the cost of an H1B were doubled and tripled, as they should be (e.g., must pay the H1B holder triple what a domestic employee would receive, and tax the employee at double the going tax rate, while also paying a $200,000 employment tax along with $200,000 annual visa maintenance costs), you would not see any H1Bs or any immigration. The ruling class are pillaging the working and middle class USA through a kind of leveraged buyout type of con job where they are getting their own people to finance and support their own pillage. It's why the ruling class is so in support of "immigration" because "immigration" makes the ruling class wealthier and more powerful as a matter of marginal increase through every "immigrant" that is imported to pillage wealth and opportunities from the native population.

But I get it, as long as people here are largely benefiting and getting wealthy from the exploitation, the exploitation is invisible to most. Not even to mention the detrimental effects of skill concentration by extracting and draining the most driven and motivated and educated from their respective countries, whether they are Nicaragua or France. All but the centralizing power are degraded by immigration and no rationalization or delusion will change that reality.

Re: H-1B Visa Most Used for 'Software Engineer,' 'Software Developer' Roles

#28

IMO, H1Bs should be given out via action style based on salary where the highest bidders (companies that need to fill the positions) get them. That's the only simple way to make sure they are not trying to replace higher cost US workers with lower cost H1B workers who are beholden to their employers every whim over threat of being kicked out.

But how do you fix the fact that large consulting companies could be paying more than say, a startup ?

Re: H-1B Visa Most Used for 'Software Engineer,' 'Software Developer' Roles

#29
post #14
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Immigrants are what built the US recently (after the real Americans... the native ones). Why close the gates now? Please don't use them (or us; though I'm not in the US) as scapegoats; this is not just. No one should have a privilege to employment. You and your potential employer shall have the right to associate freely. They should be seen just as regular competitors [with really hard barriers of entry]. If anything…

What other artificial employment barriers do you advocate removing? They may not all be just or implemented particularly well, but I think there are some (e.g., child labour, work-health standards, etc.) that make sure the economy is serving society and not the other way around.

What about if we move this discussion to focus on how you fear people from poor countries might have the competency to be your competitor in the job market?

I used to make just USD 5-10 an hour as a senior software engineer before joining a company in another country. I have no sympathy for people who were born in a developed country and feels entitled to get a job I could possibly get just because I wasn't born there. Sure, locals should be valued, but that doesn't mean you should forbid people from outside a geopolitical area to compete with fairness.

Mind your own business instead of tyring to regulate other people businesses through the government as you were a soviet. If you like communism so much and want to have the state control the employement market, why don't you move to North Korea?

Now, instead of trying to show how a heartless libertarian am I, what about if you expose why you think you have a right to force people to hire you instead of letting them choose between you and me?

Re: H-1B Visa Most Used for 'Software Engineer,' 'Software Developer' Roles

#30
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Federalism would solve a lot of the country's problems.

No. Federalism creates most of the problems in the US: drug wars, invasions overseas, absurd military expending, reduced comparative advantages between states, the evil patents system, expensive medical care, etc. The more concentrated the state apparatus, the more powerful the government and the less free and poor the people are. -- correction: I meant centralized power, not federalism.

It seems you think "federalism" means "the national [federal] government has all the power". This is a reasonable intuitive read of the word, but it's the exact opposite of what the word actually means, and your read doesn't make sense in context of the comment you are replying to.

Federalism refers to a system where two or more levels of government share power with explicit powers granted to each: the opposite of concentrating the state apparatus.

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