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US Gen Z and the iMessage Lock-In

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Re: US Gen Z and the iMessage Lock-In

#151

Post by jdminhbg »

asclepi wrote: post #97
Kadin wrote: post #64

I switched to iOS (via a used iPhone on a BYOD plan) primarily for iMessage. I was tired of being the odd man out, missing out on things that were being planned via group messages, etc. Nobody was going to switch to an entirely different mode of communication just for my sake, so the existence of theoretical alternatives doesn't really matter. (And I do try to use Facebook Messenger for group chats, so as not to lock…

> Nobody was going to switch to an entirely different mode of communication just for my sake Please elaborate. No iPhone user has to switch from the "iMessage" app to the "SMS" app to reach an Android user or include an Android user in a group chat. While it does indeed involve a different mode of communication, it's all handled seamlessly in the background from the same app. In fact, if it wasn't for the coloring, t…

> In fact, if it wasn't for the coloring, they wouldn't even have noticed, except if you exchanged other data than pure text, but I can't imagine this being a real deal-breaker for planning?

People very frequently exchange data other than pure text when event planning: GIFs, map pins, tapbacks to express [dis]agreement, etc.

Re: US Gen Z and the iMessage Lock-In

#152

Post by thekyle »

danfang wrote: post #14
pcmoney wrote: post #6

It is interesting that the comments on the Twitter thread are "Just use WhatsApp". Which is basically iMessage but from Facebook. Comparing two, the vendor lock-in from Apple seems much preferable to the one with Facebook in light of the data scandals Facebook has and their ongoing effort to backdoor WhatsApp and integrate it with FB messenger etc. Also a group message is only as secure as its most weakly encrypted m…

I don't know if this is too self promoting, but I'm part of the YC SUS 2019 program and I'm building a product that addresses the issue of messaging lock in, as well as data privacy. I'm building Thread - an ad-free, private social network for groups. It's an alternative to Facebook (Messenger and WhatsApp), iMessage and GroupMe. It's the best way to connect with, share content to, and interact with the people in you…

Can't seem to access the site. Could you elaborate on how Thread solves the problem of messenger lock in? Is it federated like Matrix?

Re: US Gen Z and the iMessage Lock-In

#153

Post by thekyle »

Barrin92 wrote: post #96
alanbernstein wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android is one arm of Google's data collection apparatus. Using an Android device allows Google to do this: https://www.google.com/maps/timeline?pb . Is this intrusive?

Given that only I can see that data (which is even stated on that very webpage), no I don't consider it intrusive. If the provision of basic services by Google to me without third parties is intrusive, then ios is intrusive in the very same way because it is 'apple's data collection apparatus'. Apple, like Google collects a vast amount of data on its users. And in addition i'm sure you're aware that google paid apple…

I think it's important to also remember that you can use Android without any of the Google services since it's open source. The same can't be said of iOS.

Re: US Gen Z and the iMessage Lock-In

#154

Post by qwerty456127 »

rconti wrote: post #89
Kadin wrote: post #64

I switched to iOS (via a used iPhone on a BYOD plan) primarily for iMessage. I was tired of being the odd man out, missing out on things that were being planned via group messages, etc. Nobody was going to switch to an entirely different mode of communication just for my sake, so the existence of theoretical alternatives doesn't really matter. (And I do try to use Facebook Messenger for group chats, so as not to lock…

Thanks for bringing up how this is Google's fault -- or, at least, the failure of Google and everyone else who isn't Apple. iMessage has lots of problems. I've screwed it up a lot of times switching SIM cards, I can never understand why it needs to know if I want to contact my iMessage contact by email or by phone number, or why the messages thread differently depending on what I use. But it GENERALLY works okay. Mea…

Use Telegram, Luke! :-) It's almost perfect. The only thing I can imagine that could make it better is an option to sort its contacts list manually.

Re: US Gen Z and the iMessage Lock-In

#155

Post by jdminhbg »

anchpop wrote: post #42
word-reader wrote: post #10

It's not just about it "being green", the contrast between the text and the background is lower with the green SMS bubbles than the blue iMessage bubbles, making it harder to read. I guarantee you if the SMS bubbles were a shade or two darker green people wouldn't care as much.

Its pretty interesting that Apple, who pride themselves so much on form, chose that undeniably unpleasant shade of green.

That shade of green pre-dates the introduction of iMessage blue. It's the original default for SMS/MMS from when that's all that iPhones suppoorted.

Re: US Gen Z and the iMessage Lock-In

#156

Post by 693471 »

iMessage is far more reliable, has richer features, never needs app updates (bc they come with the OS), E2E by default, and media attachments send faster and more reliably than SMS.

I don't blame them. SMS is terrible. And most of the other apps suck or are from untrustworthy companies.

Apple's being rewarded for good behavior.

Re: US Gen Z and the iMessage Lock-In

#157

Post by drusepth »

1_player wrote: post #9

Is WhatsApp not used in the US? Honest question. I'm in EU, I moved to an iPhone a few years ago and I've yet to receive an actual iMessage, but my friends, local or international, all use WhatsApp. I just use regular SMS for more "formal" messaging, such as with my boss or landlord, or to receive OTP codes.

Before moving to the EU I mostly used Hangouts/SMS, but now that I'm back in the US I use a mixture of Hangouts/WhatsApp. I knew a few people in school with iPhones but only a few of them used iMessage over Hangouts.

I think the most popular apps in school for group messages were apps specifically for group messaging, and I can't even remember the names of any because they were so short-lived. The one I used most had a blue speech bubble icon with a # in the middle. I'd put big money that Facebook Messenger fills that void now.

My guess is the majority of SMS usage in the US nowadays is just 2fa and automated messages, with the occasional text to an acquaintance until you add them somewhere else.

Re: US Gen Z and the iMessage Lock-In

#158

Post by jdofaz »

rconti wrote: post #89
Kadin wrote: post #64

I switched to iOS (via a used iPhone on a BYOD plan) primarily for iMessage. I was tired of being the odd man out, missing out on things that were being planned via group messages, etc. Nobody was going to switch to an entirely different mode of communication just for my sake, so the existence of theoretical alternatives doesn't really matter. (And I do try to use Facebook Messenger for group chats, so as not to lock…

Thanks for bringing up how this is Google's fault -- or, at least, the failure of Google and everyone else who isn't Apple. iMessage has lots of problems. I've screwed it up a lot of times switching SIM cards, I can never understand why it needs to know if I want to contact my iMessage contact by email or by phone number, or why the messages thread differently depending on what I use. But it GENERALLY works okay. Mea…

I suggest trying https://wire.com with your friend, way less fuss than Signal.

Re: US Gen Z and the iMessage Lock-In

#159

Post by drusepth »

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #90

It's not a real solution, but I'm kind of surprised no one has hacked up some type of iMessage forwarder for Android + an old Mac.

I think I've seen a few on HN over the years.

Here's a random one that seems to be recent: https://airmessage.org/guide/

Re: US Gen Z and the iMessage Lock-In

#160

Post by thakoppno »

tyree731 wrote: post #80
azinman2 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, but group chat over SMS is crap. Lots of Android phones as well don’t operate group SMS well, you get reduced resolution in photos and videos, can’t like/heart messages in the same way, no typing indicators, etc etc. Losing iMessage features sucks when you’re otherwise used to it.

IMHO the bigger problem with group chat over SMS is that some networks (looking at you AT&T) limit the number of participants in a group SMS chat to ten. If you try to send a message to more than ten people it sends it ten of them, silently ignoring the rest, leading to weird fractured SMS group chats.

you are right about the limit of ten. but it may be part of the sms specification itself. at least that’s what i remember from looking it up a couple years ago.
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