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Apple Is Locking iPhone Batteries to Discourage Repair

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Re: Apple Is Locking iPhone Batteries to Discourage Repair

#221
post #201
post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In both these cases had the actual hardware ever made it to the Apple repair depot (which has more expertise than the average Apple Genius and is not located on the back of the store, contrary to what Luis may think) then they undoubtedly would have come to the same conclusion that Luis did about the ease of the repair, and would have charged accordingly. What Luis heard from the store was a preliminary estimate, not…

Both videos mention suggestions to buy a new computer because repair cost is close to the price of a new one. In such case, the computer would never reach a repair depot. As to Rossmann being a hater, I too have seen so many stories of Apple denying warranty for made up reasons (liquid damage, etc) that it is very difficult to believe that Apple is acting in good faith when it comes to repairs.

Apple's warranty and their water damage sensors are absolutely useless. The water damage sensors go off if you are in a humid area and along with it goes your warranty. I had problems with my keyboard macbook 2015. Took my laptop to the apple store and was basically told that warranty is void due to water damage. I don't understand know how this is legal?

Re: Apple Is Locking iPhone Batteries to Discourage Repair

#223

Despite all the HN comments, Apple's made an absolute killing and charges FAR FAR higher margins for their products in part because they design them so normal people don't get totally f'd over. And yes, the scam of a trash after market battery to make the iphone battery life look good is well known. And guess how many parents and grandparents then go to apple to "fix" something that has nothing to do with Apple? The…

A cracked screen repair on a recent iphone is $200, which I think is very high.

I think if they lowered the price of common repairs to "reasonable", then good things would happen.

If instead of becoming a source of profit, repairs became more costly to apple, maybe they might: make things more modular and repairable, make parts available, allow external repairs.

(I could be idealistic and wrong)

Re: Apple Is Locking iPhone Batteries to Discourage Repair

#224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, if they made the batteries easily replaceable without the device having to go to service they would not have this many issues. Of course their replacement batteries would need to be reasonably priced...

Anecdotes are worthless, but in the past half decade the only people I know who have successfully replaced a smartphone or pad battery have been Apple device owners. Apple has an easy, clear, successful program for replacing batteries, and most find the pricing entirely reasonable. A friend did buy a Nexus 6P battery replacement kit from Amazon, but the process was so byzantine, and no shop was willing to do it, that…

>Anecdotes are worthless, but in the past half decade the only people I know who have successfully replaced a smartphone or pad battery have been Apple device owners.

More anecdotes, but it's too bad you don't know me. I've replaced 3 or 4 phone batteries in the last decade. Needless to say, they've all been Android, as I've been able to do them all myself. Most of the batteries have been $30 or so and have given me years more life on my phones than I otherwise would have gotten.

Re: Apple Is Locking iPhone Batteries to Discourage Repair

#225

Despite all the HN comments, Apple's made an absolute killing and charges FAR FAR higher margins for their products in part because they design them so normal people don't get totally f'd over. And yes, the scam of a trash after market battery to make the iphone battery life look good is well known. And guess how many parents and grandparents then go to apple to "fix" something that has nothing to do with Apple? The…

After many hours and tiresome calls with Apple global support and getting nowhere I told them I must take the issue to social media so others might avoid the same issue. The service agent responded “we have a large team of people who respond to such posts”.

I wonder if they're required to disclose they’re employees of Apple. If so, they could hire an external company to do the Job.

Hard to know these days.

Re: Apple Is Locking iPhone Batteries to Discourage Repair

#226
post #184
post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one is claiming that apple is training their geniuses to intentionally guide people to more expensive repairs. In fact they are accusing apple of a lack of adequate training, These guys just don't know that what they're saying is untrue. Apple's failed to train their technicians to repair anything. all they can do is replace.

The commenter I responded to literally said that the genius intentionally told the customer the wrong thing. They have since edited that part out. So yes, folks right here are claiming intent where there is none.

You can’t claim there was no intent either right? Whether there was or was not intent is unknown.

“It may or may not have been intentional, but I was guided to buy a more expensive option”.

Re: Apple Is Locking iPhone Batteries to Discourage Repair

#228
post #201
post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In both these cases had the actual hardware ever made it to the Apple repair depot (which has more expertise than the average Apple Genius and is not located on the back of the store, contrary to what Luis may think) then they undoubtedly would have come to the same conclusion that Luis did about the ease of the repair, and would have charged accordingly. What Luis heard from the store was a preliminary estimate, not…

Both videos mention suggestions to buy a new computer because repair cost is close to the price of a new one. In such case, the computer would never reach a repair depot. As to Rossmann being a hater, I too have seen so many stories of Apple denying warranty for made up reasons (liquid damage, etc) that it is very difficult to believe that Apple is acting in good faith when it comes to repairs.

Frankly I wouldn’t put it past Rossmann to make up that anecdote about the Genius suggesting they buy a new computer. That’s just not how Apple works in my experience.

As to your second point, I’ve had only positive experiences with them with repairs both in and out of warranty. However some of that may be because I always buy at an Apple store, rather than at third parties, because doing so gives their systems more visibility into the detailed history of the specific item I buy, and thus they have more leeway and discretion to solve problems in very nice ways. It’s likely that many horror stories you’ve heard are dramatized after the fact by people who went for a sketchy discount purchase and want someone to blame. People do lie, and liquid damage is a real thing.

Re: Apple Is Locking iPhone Batteries to Discourage Repair

#229
post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple doesn't want their customers to get f'd over you say? You might want to check out Luis Rosmann's videos, a famous Apple repair geek who fixes for cheap the products Apple themselves misdiagnose[1] in order to rip off their customers[2]. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7RXJP4mxCc // teenager's MacBook's display is not working correctly so Geniuses tell him he needs a new motherboard replacement while Luis d…

In both these cases had the actual hardware ever made it to the Apple repair depot (which has more expertise than the average Apple Genius and is not located on the back of the store, contrary to what Luis may think) then they undoubtedly would have come to the same conclusion that Luis did about the ease of the repair, and would have charged accordingly. What Luis heard from the store was a preliminary estimate, not…

Missed the edit window for a typo but fantastic channel, that was supposed to say, not chance. And, I would think, also a good business for him at this point.

Re: Apple Is Locking iPhone Batteries to Discourage Repair

#230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Theoretically they could properly detect a crappy replacement too by doing some basic math to determine approximate capacity sigh If such "basic math" exists, can someone please point me to it? Estimating capacity on a fully known, completely characterized cell is the bane of my existence. Basic math that can help estimate approximate capacity of an unknown replacement battery- that's a billion dollar startup worth…

Please explain, what exactly are you doing that the standard look at the charge curve and compare with battery voltage and use known charge current and time won't solve? This is pretty much how all the battery capacity estimators work to my knowledge. As long as the chemistry is known it should hold true, sure, you'll get some variation based on load but you should be able to account for that pretty with some testing…

> Please explain, what exactly are you doing that the standard look at the charge curve and compare with battery voltage and use known charge current and time won't solve?

If only it were that simple. In the real world, when you have a load that’s drawing from the battery, the voltage across the terminals will be different from the voltage on an open circuit for the same battery at the “battery level” (state of charge is the commonly used term)

To make matters worse, the life of the battery remaining at any point depends upon the current drawn from it. If you were to draw a smaller current, it’ll last longer - and this is purely because batteries are weird and has nothing to do with the charge curve. For something like a LED flashlight that always draws the same current - this isn’t a problem. A modern smartphone on the other hand is essentially unpredictable.

Then you have the numerical problem with integrating current over time - the errors add up over time too! Now you have to measure the current out of the battery with a high sampling rate with a great adc - it’s a massive power draw. Most modern fuel gauge ICs are moving away from measuring current because of all the trouble with cumulative errors.

I can go on for a while longer, but I think you get the picture.

> Accubattery seems to give a pretty good approximation using just this information at least, would definitely be sufficient for detecting cells that were fraudulent by more than 10-20%

Accubattery can afford to monitor multiple charge and discharge cycles before converging on a battery model. A smartphone needs to know what battery it has when you plug in your newly replaced battery to charge it for the very first time to ensure it doesn’t become a fire or safety hazard. Similar concerns with discharging a battery. Look up the exploding Samsung Galaxy note 7 for an example of how serious this can be.

> As long as the chemistry is known it should hold true, sure, you'll get some variation based on load but you should be able to account for that pretty with some testing or careful probing at minimal current draw.

If only it were this easy. I’ve had battery vendors - the people who make this stuff - give me specs on charging that battery that would kill the battery in 250 charge cycles.

It’s a very bizarre field to work in - many times, you can get away with very crude approximations and no one can tell the difference. But once in a while, a very very tiny deviation from the spec will give you exploding devices and have your product be announced as a safety hazard in every flight before take off (yay! free publicity...)

The challenge is that you never know when you can get away with something and when 1 in a million devices will explode on a tech journalist/reporter/reviewer.

With batteries, esp with Lithium Ion cells, nobody is going to take chances with approximations.

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