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Facebook Hit by Apple’s Crackdown on Messaging Feature

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Re: Facebook Hit by Apple’s Crackdown on Messaging Feature

#151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Signal docs say it needs Background permission : "Without this, there may be a delay in sending and receiving messages." https://support.signal.org/hc/en-us/articles/360007062172-Si...

That doesn’t mean encryption won’t work, just that you may not get instant notification of messages.

Yes, but I did not mention security. I commented on "I don’t think Signal uses it". I should've quoted it.

Re: Facebook Hit by Apple’s Crackdown on Messaging Feature

#152

I've noticed something sneaky about Facebook on my phone. I refuse to install their apps but I do use Facebook a bit so I use it via the phone Browser (in my case, Chrome on Android). I've noticed that sometimes Facebook shows a fake 'youve got a message' icon to try and trick you into installing their messenger app. To re-produce this behaviour: (this works best if you dont get a lot of facebook messages. Also you n…

Have you tried messenger.com from your browser? Edit: Just went on it. On a browser you have to enable desktop mode for login to show. Also if you login this way and disable desktop mode it forces you out. If you reenable it renders the chat. Theres no reason the chat wouldnt work on Mobile desktop mode isnt using a different browser just lying to the web server and frontend JS. Amazing. I already rarely use Facebook…

I actually believe part of it is that they rely on this editor[1] for the messenger and anyone who tries to use it on any device that supports IME (like phones) will find that it does not work at all.

[1] https://github.com/facebook/draft-js

Re: Facebook Hit by Apple’s Crackdown on Messaging Feature

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Signal docs say it needs Background permission : "Without this, there may be a delay in sending and receiving messages." https://support.signal.org/hc/en-us/articles/360007062172-Si...

That doesn’t mean encryption won’t work, just that you may not get instant notification of messages.

I wouldn't be so sure about that: https://twitter.com/moxie/status/1158852855291269120

Re: Facebook Hit by Apple’s Crackdown on Messaging Feature

#154
post #150
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not being able to lurk in the background does not have anything to do with security. I don’t think Signal uses it and they’re generally considered secure. You can check out their source.

The current Apple VoIP APIs don't actually let apps run in the background all the time anyway. What they provide is a way to instantly remotely wake up an app, let it connect to your server in the background, do some local processing, and then create and display a notification. This is exactly what end-to-end encrypted messaging needs, but Apple is killing off the ability to use the VoIP APIs in this way in iOS 13. S…

This is what is confusing about this article anyway. You used to be able to run your VoIP application in the background all of the time. This has been closed for longer. But WhatsApp and Facebook are really old apps, supporting pretty ancient versions of iOS (last time I checked). They might have inherited the capabilities back from the time it was the only way to have VoIP?

The intended way VoIP application should work is using PushKit and CallKit to show a native call screen after receiving a special VoIP push notification message. Only when the user accepts the actual application will open.

"Background App Refresh" is used for silent push notifications, which should be used to download content when the application is not running. It could be used to download images in messages ahead of time, though could be abused just as well. "Background App Refresh" is not a reliable way to deliver notifications to an application since they're dropped pretty easily.

Re: Facebook Hit by Apple’s Crackdown on Messaging Feature

#155
The article focuses on making calls, but moxie (from Signal) had this to say:

"PushKit is the only way to do e2e encrypted messaging in iOS. If they take that away, they're disabling the ability for messaging apps to function with e2e encryption. I don't see how Apple can frame that as "enhancing user privacy and security?" "

https://twitter.com/moxie/status/1158852855291269120 So it's not only about being able to answer calls quickly.

Re: Facebook Hit by Apple’s Crackdown on Messaging Feature

#156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn’t mean encryption won’t work, just that you may not get instant notification of messages.

I wouldn't be so sure about that: https://twitter.com/moxie/status/1158852855291269120

Would be interesting to hear his opinion on this. It's awesome anyway that all of the source is just in the open. I often use it as a sanity check for my own code when I'm dealing with messaging and VoIP.

Re: Facebook Hit by Apple’s Crackdown on Messaging Feature

#157
post #154
post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The current Apple VoIP APIs don't actually let apps run in the background all the time anyway. What they provide is a way to instantly remotely wake up an app, let it connect to your server in the background, do some local processing, and then create and display a notification. This is exactly what end-to-end encrypted messaging needs, but Apple is killing off the ability to use the VoIP APIs in this way in iOS 13. S…

This is what is confusing about this article anyway. You used to be able to run your VoIP application in the background all of the time. This has been closed for longer. But WhatsApp and Facebook are really old apps, supporting pretty ancient versions of iOS (last time I checked). They might have inherited the capabilities back from the time it was the only way to have VoIP? The intended way VoIP application should w…

VoIP apps built against the iOS 9 SDK and earlier can still run in the background all the time, but we know WhatsApp and Facebook Messenger have used iOS SDK 10 or higher since 2016 because they introduced support for CallKik back then which requires that version. Also, the current version of their apps only support iOS 9 and newer and PushKit has been available since 8. As far as I can tell, the media coverage is just misleading in a way that pushes their existing narratives about Facebook and Apple.

Re: Facebook Hit by Apple’s Crackdown on Messaging Feature

#158

I've noticed something sneaky about Facebook on my phone. I refuse to install their apps but I do use Facebook a bit so I use it via the phone Browser (in my case, Chrome on Android). I've noticed that sometimes Facebook shows a fake 'youve got a message' icon to try and trick you into installing their messenger app. To re-produce this behaviour: (this works best if you dont get a lot of facebook messages. Also you n…

(I worked at FB, but not on this.)

It's probably a bug. I use the FB apps on Android and Chrome on Win/Mac, and sometimes the notification thing goes out of sync and is stuck on "1" for a few days, and nothing seems to help. Then eventually it goes away. I'm 99.99% sure this is a some cache/consistency bug and not a trick. It's super annoying when it happens to me.

Re: Facebook Hit by Apple’s Crackdown on Messaging Feature

#159
post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That even today many European languages don't even have a basic dictionary. I'm not talking about the "guess the next word" feature. All I want is a dictionary that could suggest a correction to a misspelled word. Use two languages at once? No way! I guess they need to invent a new chip or something. Swipe to type? Hehe. The keyboard in itself is fast and good but it lacks features.

The state of auto-suggest and auto-correct for anything but English (or maybe French, German, not a speaker so I don't know) is appalling. Auto-suggest is either not even an option or if it is it takes you to type almost the full word before suggesting something sensible. The auto-correct is way worse though. It sometimes suggests corrections to a wrongly spelled word even on basics like pronouns and such. But also l…

Those teams existed, but were disbanded and those people are now drawing up new emojis.

Re: Facebook Hit by Apple’s Crackdown on Messaging Feature

#160
post #131
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On iOS you can switch the keyboard with the small “globe” key between the “123” button and the dictation button on the lower left hand side of the keyboard, it’s one key press- assuming you added the keyboard in settings.

That's still too many steps - the trouble with bi/tri-lingual life is you often interject words (places, addresses, proper nouns) in the local language into sentences in any of the other two languages. Constantly opening and closing settings dialogs gets on your nerves in the long run.

Adding a language to your phone (once) is too much work? Or is a “button” press to swap out the keyboard too much? I don’t understand.

I use English, Swedish accents and Russian with no issue. :s

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