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8chan Is a Normal Part of Mass Shootings Now

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321–330 of 378 posts

Re: 8chan Is a Normal Part of Mass Shootings Now

#321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Literally the first item on a DGG search: "How Charlottesville and Gamergate are Completely Related" Second item: "Matthew Robert Warner: From GamerGate to Identity Evropa"

By this logic Zoe Quinn is the reason for the rise of 21st century nazism.

No, but GamerGate is in the west.

Re: 8chan Is a Normal Part of Mass Shootings Now

#322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Men are half the population. Many men are poor, have lack of job opportunities, just like poor women. Identity politics that completely ignores economic conditions people face will always be flat and can't explain the depth of complexity different people in society face.

What causes the much higher incidence of homelessness in males compared to females?

They are more likely to fit into risk factor profile: more likely to have mental disease. They are more likely to be veterans. More likely to be addicted addictions or disabled.

Also more likely to be violent or aggressive and thus kicked from legit places to live. More likely to have criminal record. The whole "on average men take their aggression against others women again themselves" in this aspect hurt men more.

Some of the above are related to each other, obviously.

Re: 8chan Is a Normal Part of Mass Shootings Now

#323
post #15

Does anyone have an idea of how big 8chan and 4chan is in terms of users? Just from the visible activity in there I can see they must be massive. I think Slate is incorrect in describing them as expression of traditional neo-nazism. To me they are quite their own thing. Born out of Anime culture and gaming-culture becoming a playground for role playing, trash talking, trolling, real-life pranks degenerating into what…

> You start by joking that you are a jew-hating nazi and then after a while you become an actual jew-hating nazi. How does that work psychologically? I think that's just a reaction of the mind to repeated exposure. There was an article on the work of Facebook contractors who are responsible for moderating content: one of the interviewees confessed that they ended up unintentionally internalizing/accepting the tin-foi…

> My theory is you don't even have to say it jokingly, you just have to see it over and over again, and the mind will learn by rote - using the same underlying hardware as spaced repetition.

If that were true, all of HN would be Rust evangelists and/or users of pure functional programming languages.

Re: 8chan Is a Normal Part of Mass Shootings Now

#324

The theory seems to be that white supremacists just naturally wish to commit violent hate crimes and that white supremacists use 8chan to indoctrinate more followers. What if it turns out that white supremacists primary wish is to have their arguments heard by society, but society has instead cast them out and refuses to let them post elsewhere so they can only post on 8chan, and that some of them, mentally unstable,…

So you basically have no idea what you’re talking about but want to talk about giving a wider platform to nazis?

Just for the record here: I think it's a good thing when people are willing to admit they're ignorant about certain things. It shows that they are willing to learn and change their minds based on new information.

Re: 8chan Is a Normal Part of Mass Shootings Now

#325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When a young woman has trouble with life she's given sympathy and resources. When a young man has trouble he's told to stop being such a wimp. Not surprisingly some of them snap.

Yeah. Men are still, to a huge extent, discouraged from sharing and expressing their emotions as much as women (since that behavior is seen as inherently feminine). People still make fun of guys for crying and other healthy ways of expressing distress. The "strong silent type" still seems to be many people's masculine ideal. This is exacerbated on hate-filled sites like 4chan and 8chan, where guys who express feeling…

> When men on 8chan start buying into racist ideology and feeling like they can only express their distress through anger and violence, it seems inevitable that things like shootings will follow.

I agree, but there is even more to this part. The Nazi ideology was not just about superiority, about also about struggle between races for power and need to win that struggle. You have to fight for your own and prove superiority through military conquest and physical domination of other races.

For that to happen, you need certain kind of fighter. Ruthlessness and nazi really seen ruthlessness as virtue.

Empathetic male eager to share emotions is less likely to gain domination through violence. Or through manipulation, backstabbing, lying and all those things that are seen as practical tactic by white supremacists. Less likely to push knowingly for laws that harm minorities or political opponents. Less likely beat or kill opponent. Less likely to force own friends into compliance with own ideas.

By that I want to say that the aggressive masculinity is virtue and something you want males to be, if you have aggressive goals. Hence peer pressuring males to be like that.

Re: 8chan Is a Normal Part of Mass Shootings Now

#326
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's their parents' home, no? The US middle class is shrinking. And it's always dangerous to have lots of young men with no prospects. With no future worth living into. But seriously, mass shootings are just a sideshow. It's the political implications that are truly frightening.

>That's their parents' home, no? Are there a lot of parents that won't allow their kin to live with them when the only other option is homelessness?

Kicking them out might not mean instant homelessness, they can get a job before leaving the house, crash on a friends couch.

However they're at a much greater risk of becoming homeless.

Re: 8chan Is a Normal Part of Mass Shootings Now

#327
post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nick Griffin's electoral success was not killed by his appearance on Question Time. In fact, a bunch of minority political positions have had a good deal of political oxygen from BBC appearances: I'm thinking mostly of Farage in the dog days of UKIP's popularity and also the Spiked!/Institute of Ideas collective. Griffin lost largely because there was factional instability in the BNP and then the rise of UKIP stole t…

He got absolutely mullered on Question time so I find that hard to believe.

Even so, it's very difficult to kill a political movement by logical debate (or even by making them look silly). I had the misfortune to know Mark Collett (another one of the BNPers) at Leeds University. We managed to stop him making much headway in recruitment etc., but he lived for the publicity. Even when he got thrashed at Union AGMs and the like he'd be busy pitching to his potential support in the audience. Didn't work on most (he lost his votes by a landslide) but he wasn't actually trying to win. And I suspect getting his arguments attacked by a bunch of lefties and Jews didn't harm him much in his constituency, either. After all, it's all a conspiracy to stop him talking, isn't it?

Re: 8chan Is a Normal Part of Mass Shootings Now

#328
post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This applies to a very small minority of men. The confident, attractive types with great bodies. An average woman will still get lots of attention on dating website and have a lot of guys to pick from, an average guy won't really get any attention on such websites. I don't know where you live/what dating pool you have experience with, but here are some contrasting anecdotal observations from NYC: 1) Straight women…

Regarding #1 and #2, I think it's even worse: there are lots of "auto swipe" apps that swipe right on everyone. It's a common hack for guys to buy Tinder Premium, swipe right on everyone in sight and then choose from the match pool. Tinder is a super lazy product, terrible even. I wouldn't be surprised if they're optimizing for a high number of matches and happy with that outcome.

Supposedly Tinder drops your 'ranking' if you swipe right on everyone. Anyway, no need to use autoswipe apps. Tinder has a webapp so you can just setInterval() that like button.

Re: 8chan Is a Normal Part of Mass Shootings Now

#329

I think that technology has brought us some truly marvelous things. But they also enable us to avoid casual social contact while enabling us to withdraw from meaningful social contact. Online anonymity permits endless Sybil attacks -- helping turn communities' frustration from anger and rage into violence. I'm guessing/assuming that 8chan is an anything goes censorship free community (like 4chan was/is?). And maybe i…

“In a Sybil attack, the attacker subverts the reputation system of a peer-to-peer network by creating a large number of pseudonymous identities and uses them to gain a disproportionately large influence.”

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sybil_attack

Re: 8chan Is a Normal Part of Mass Shootings Now

#330
post #40

We could talk about how this is largely a mental health problem. A lot of depressed young men do stupid risky stuff with no concern for their own well-being. I know a few guys who have wrapped their cars around trees. I bet most shooters were just throwing in the towel in a more hateful and dramatic way. I see the main issue as a marketing problem for psychology. Men are focused on solving problems, and I'd bet they…

this is such a bad take on the real issue which is the radicalization of these men by website like the *chans. saying "this is largely a mental health problem" completely ignores the problem of large scale violence the far-right is committing, and only perpetuates thinking of these people as "lone wolves". they may seem like that from the outside, but seeing how much destruction they've done over the past few years m…

Can you not believe all of these are various inputs linked to the outcome?

There are millions of far right activists and likely a non zero percentage of them have the same views as the shooter. Yet the shooter was the one to break out while the rest of them stood still. Radicalization requires people in poor situations to do its biddings; regular people may fall into the propaganda trap but most people would never sacrifice the comfort of their lives for an abstract political cause.

I believe it is more of an education problem than a mental health. These movements based on the absence of facts and extremely reaching claims could only survive if the people participating do not have the tools to catch the logical snafus and realize they are being tricked. That people do not realize this and continue to fall for these movements tell me that we failed to equip my generation with the skepticism that results in critical thinking skills.

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