Live data from Hacker News

Why Lie Detector Tests Can’t Be Trusted

smithsonianmag.com

191–200 of 201 posts

Re: Why Lie Detector Tests Can’t Be Trusted

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"as much as US$60,000 each. The Iraqi government is said to have spent £52 million on the devices" - Wow and no one thought hey let's test this baby out before we buy a thousand of them?

They did test them. Dowsing rods work very well in unblinded tests. That's a big part of why so many people believe in dowsing.

I'm gonna have to call BS on that. Finding water accidentally is astronomically more likely than finding a bomb.

Re: Why Lie Detector Tests Can’t Be Trusted

#192

I took a polygraph twice for an NSA internship (TS/CSI Clearance). It's an interesting process. In the first phase, you go over your security forms (SF-86 and related) in detail with your polygraph examiner. They ask a lot of detailed questions, sometimes including things you aren't legally required to disclose (drug use and foreign travel outside the listed time limits). In the second phase, they hook you up to the…

Very similar to my experience, but different 3-letter agency. Two rounds. Lots of questions about drug use. I wasn't shy about it because I had had legal run-ins over it when I was young so I knew it was already out there. But examiner claimed that I was being evasive. My employer really wanted me cleared so I was coached a bit, told that unless I admit to being a spy it almost doesn't matter what I admit I have done…

Did you pass?

Re: Why Lie Detector Tests Can’t Be Trusted

#193
post #54

There's a lot of hyperbolic claims being made in the article and these comments which seem unsupported by science. The answer to the question, "can polygraphs be utilized to draw out truth?", is a resounding yes: >Notwithstanding the limitations of the quality of the empirical research and the limited ability to generalize to real-world settings, we conclude that in populations of examinees such as those represented…

> Although it is not a silver bullet, it certainly has its applications, especially if the person being interviewed believes it works. The whole premise of a lie-detector test is that they are marketed to end user and the public at large as being both accurate and "scientific." That they yield results better than chance isn't particularly relevant: they are not what the sellers and users of them claim they are. The c…

Most science isn't accurate, that's why it's filled with p-values. They're often only reporting the mere hint of an effect which allows them to distinguish between a control and experimental population.

Polygraphs are almost certainly not reliable enough to convict someone on, but it's not admissible in court. That doesn't mean it can't be used to help coerce a confession or help lead an investigation. And the fact that you won't face up to the extraordinary amount of evidence showing that it can be useful suggests stubborn ignorance on your behalf.

Re: Why Lie Detector Tests Can’t Be Trusted

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They did test them. Dowsing rods work very well in unblinded tests. That's a big part of why so many people believe in dowsing.

I'm gonna have to call BS on that. Finding water accidentally is astronomically more likely than finding a bomb.

Unblinded tests mean that the tester knows where the bomb is. Imagine you have a bomb on a table. Someone brings a bomb detector over and when they point it at the bomb, it indicates that a bomb is detected. Point it away, and it stops. This is a very convincing demonstration if you don't suspect shenanigans.

Re: Why Lie Detector Tests Can’t Be Trusted

#195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is that even supposed to work?

By making you believe that it works, like every other aspect of the process.

Then they're going to need to go with an electrical sensor of some sort. Some kind of EBG that could at least plausibly detect it.

Re: Why Lie Detector Tests Can’t Be Trusted

#196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By making you believe that it works, like every other aspect of the process.

Then they're going to need to go with an electrical sensor of some sort. Some kind of EBG that could at least plausibly detect it.

Something that's kind of rough and uncomfortable would make the most sense, especially if you had to sit in some exact place for several hours. Discomfort would add to the stress.

Re: Why Lie Detector Tests Can’t Be Trusted

#198
post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sadly, 'Fuck you and the horse you rode in on' would be an inappropriate response.

Entirely appropriate as you get up and leave. Seriously. There is no other appropriate reaction unless you're terrified of retribution because it's the USSR or one of the wannabes. Price of freedom, etc. etc. I'd be throwing in the word "Traitor" if it were me, but only on the basis that it is absolutely true.

After being accused of sex with animals, it's still probably unwise to discuss fucking the high horse someone rode in on.

Re: Why Lie Detector Tests Can’t Be Trusted

#199

I took a polygraph twice for an NSA internship (TS/CSI Clearance). It's an interesting process. In the first phase, you go over your security forms (SF-86 and related) in detail with your polygraph examiner. They ask a lot of detailed questions, sometimes including things you aren't legally required to disclose (drug use and foreign travel outside the listed time limits). In the second phase, they hook you up to the…

Me too. I'm interested to know when this was because I am reading between the lines and believe little has changed on the questions between when you did it and I.

At my time I was told that all interviews at a certain exit off I-95 in Maryland were done by FBI.

I expect several people reading your note might also have gone through this process and failed. Interested to hear if anyone has successfully retrieved transcripts using a FOIA request.

Re: Why Lie Detector Tests Can’t Be Trusted

#200

I took a polygraph twice for an NSA internship (TS/CSI Clearance). It's an interesting process. In the first phase, you go over your security forms (SF-86 and related) in detail with your polygraph examiner. They ask a lot of detailed questions, sometimes including things you aren't legally required to disclose (drug use and foreign travel outside the listed time limits). In the second phase, they hook you up to the…

>If you're particularly desirable to the managers who're looking to hire you, they'll keep inviting you to take more polygraphs, and you'll eventually pass. Now, I am no expert on these things, but something tells me that they are doing this wrong. "All of your previous polygraph tests indicated to us that you couldn't be trusted as far as we could throw you, however your latest one clearly shows that you have sudden…

Polygraphs can be "inconclusive" many times. Especially if you the kind of person that is uncomfortable sitting still and breathing in the same rhythm for an extended period.
Post reply on HN