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Ethiopia Plants 350M Trees in One Day to Combat Drought and Climate Change

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Re: Ethiopia Plants 350M Trees in One Day to Combat Drought and Climate Change

#121
post #106
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if we're talking geopolitically yes of course, if we're talking culturally yes of course. The other leaders at some point like Portugal, Netherlands, UK, Spain, all had their time in the sun. Now it is the U.S's, I'm not making the claim this will remain in perpetuity.

>geopolitically yes of course Currently your international relations with most countries are in shambles. You've got a nearly 20 year war going with Afganistan over a terrorist attack that wasn't sponsored by the country, and it doesn't look like the Taliban is going to actually disapear. Your other misadventure into Iraq completely destabilized the area, and resulted in creation of ISIS. >culturally yes of course Go…

> Currently your international relations with most countries are in shambles.

That's an empty, meaningless claim. Even if it were true (it's not), it simply does not matter very much. When Obama was in office, it was celebrations, so to speak. When Trump is gone in N years, normalcy will return, even if it requires some relationship repair. A few years does not matter in any grand scheme when it comes to relationships between the US and eg France or Britain. One President is not going to wreck relationships that are hundreds of years old. Trump is not worse than what Bush put us through with Iraq 15 years ago when it comes to international relations, not even remotely close.

> You've got a nearly 20 year war going with Afganistan over a terrorist attack that wasn't sponsored by the country, and it doesn't look like the Taliban is going to actually disapear.

That's a bogus premise. The US didn't go into Afghanistan to destroy the Taliban. The US achieved its primary objective in Afghanistan a very long time ago - neutralizing Al Qaeda as a globally threatening, effective, large terrorist organization. Removing the Taliban and establishing a stable democratic Afghanistan, is the stretch goal that was always going to be very difficult to accomplish. It's questionable that such a thing could be accomplished short of fully occupying every inch of the country and pouring hundreds of billions of dollars into it annually. Is the US going to fail to achieve an impossible goal of nation building a democratic Afghanistan in under 20 years? Yeah.

> Your other misadventure into Iraq completely destabilized the area, and resulted in creation of ISIS.

That one is partially correct. It's the dictatorships of the Middle East (nearly all nations in the Middle East are without functioning democracy and most are very illiberal; the US has introduced two of the few examples of democracy in Iraq and Afghanistan), their systems of government, and Islamic extremism, that perpetually destabilizes the region. Some of that mess is entirely localized, some of it has been introduced by foreign powers over centuries. You already know that of course, the Taliban (the theocratic group you mentioned the US is failing to remove) are a prime example of it. There is no such thing as a stable dictatorship or stable theocracy (they require constant threats or applications of violence to hold their positions). Nearly all dictatorships in modern history have resulted in disaster and chaos in their wake. Whenever Saddam's regime fell (however long that would have taken without the US involvement), it was always going to result in the sort of chaos that we've seen in Iraq, as the country is a forced-together bifurcated society of conflicting factions. The US should have never gone into Iraq, however it's also false to pretend that Iraq was stable or functioning well before that (What does a wildly violent, murderous stable dictatorship mean exactly? That's a contradiction in terms. Stable in what regard, the lack of all basic human rights and democratic institutions? Stable in the application of consistent terror to oppress the people?).

Re: Ethiopia Plants 350M Trees in One Day to Combat Drought and Climate Change

#122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How so? When replanting clear cuts here in Sweden with pine or fir each tree takes a few seconds to plant - you stamp your tool in to the ground which makes a hole, drop the plant down, stomp the ground and then your off to the next. There is also no need to tend to them afterwards (except treatment to deter deer/elks).

Which is a scattergun approach, no? What's the survival rate? I'd guess 1:100 if you're not tending them. But, in Ethiopia many of those trees are going to need watering, surely? Protecting from people gathering firewood? Sweden and Ethiopia seem pretty different wrt tree planting?

Definitely a scattergun approach but that’s similar to how nature does it, I’ve heard the survival rate for seedlings in north American confirer forests to be about 1:1,000,000.

Re: Ethiopia Plants 350M Trees in One Day to Combat Drought and Climate Change

#123
post #8

I wish them luck. I'm a sort of history buff and Ethiopia has an amazing history. It's been a state (in various forms and with different names) for more than 2000 years, in a part of the world where such stability has been scarce. It has its own ancient alphabet. It was the only country in Africa to resist the Scramble for Africa and was only occupied by Italy for less than 10 years (after putting the Italian Army to…

Can you recommend a book on the history of Ethiopia? I've been meaning to read about it for a while.

"There Is No Me Without You" is another good book. It's a bit more personal and looks at the AIDS situation in Ethiopia, but an excellent read:

https://www.amazon.com/There-No-Me-Without-You/dp/1596912936

Re: Ethiopia Plants 350M Trees in One Day to Combat Drought and Climate Change

#124
post #95
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're going to have to elaborate, I didn't understand your point at all. I look forward to watching you attempt to demonstrate that appropriation of native land, and free labor from slavery, aren't the pillars on which most wealth in the US was built. I'm sure it will be entertaining.

Sure, butter production in the southern states where there was "unlimited free labor" was roughly 20% of the national output, even though they had 40% of the total dairy cows. So there is your counter point to the argument that with "free labor" things got massively built. Quite the opposite. Its hard to get high productivity from slave labor (go figure). Anyhow, one has to observe to be first aware of such things li…

First, I'll note that you haven't addressed the "unlimited land" part at all. Shall I conclude that you agree with me, at least, that appropriation of native land was one of the pillars of US wealth creation?

> butter production in the southern states where there was "unlimited free labor" was roughly 20% of the national output, even though they had 40% of the total dairy cows.

So from this one example, you're extrapolating that slavery did not play a major role in the creation of overall US wealth? That is a... bold claim, to put it lightly. It is not supported by contemporary historians, and your other comments don't exactly inspire confidence as to your mastery if History, so forgive me for being skeptical.

How about you start by telling me, of the 13 original colonies, how many had slaves? And, perhaps, how much wealth had been accumulated in the original colonies before they abolished slavery?

From there, perhaps move on to researching how slavery enriched the North, even after abolition.

> I'd also like to point that during the peak of the British Empire in the late 19th century up to the early 20th century, the British had by that point outlawed slavery.

I fail to see how that is relevant to the US.

Before you take your British Empire comparison too far, you might want to research the origin of the empire's wealth during the 19th and 20th century...

I'll give you a hint: it's explained in this book, which I recommend reading if you're interested in this topic. https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/32618967-an-era-of-darkn...

> I'm roughly 25% "native" like you keep referencing to.

Oh you're Native American, that's great! What tribe?

Not only does your genetics test not matter, by claiming native heritage in this way you are participating in something which actual Native Americans find problematic.

If you want to learn more on this topic, here is a good starting point: https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg22129554-400-there-is...

Re: Ethiopia Plants 350M Trees in One Day to Combat Drought and Climate Change

#125
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US already has the cleanest of water and air. No need to do anything when you are leading the others bigly.

Edit: Damn. I think OP was being sarcastic. A quick look through the comment history shows a different view than the one expressed in the comment. I removed the downvote. ---Original comment--- Here's why I downvoted you: - It doesn't matter if the water is clean or dirty because that's not what's causing climate change. - The United States was the second largest emitter of carbon dioxide in 2015. CO2 is a leading ca…

You're right but it's a reference to Mike Pence saying it a few weeks ago.

Re: Ethiopia Plants 350M Trees in One Day to Combat Drought and Climate Change

#126
post #36

I'm not a botanist, but if they are experiencing drought then how will these newly planted trees survive? According to the article they are so low on water they are slashing output on their hydro-power system and ceasing electricity exports.

Assuming they planted native tree's then they should be fine. Tree's don't need ground aquifers, they create them. They pull in moisture from the air and gather it from the rain. They stabilize the soil which helps to drain and collect the water effectively tunneling it into the ground aquifers. It's common knowledge where I live that if you want to bring water back to your property then you need to plant grass and tree's on your property.

Re: Ethiopia Plants 350M Trees in One Day to Combat Drought and Climate Change

#127
Did anyone else find the 350M number implausible?

They claim it happened in 12 hours. Unless they're talking about planting seeds, I find it hard to believe and take this story just as a political stunt.

Ethiopia's population is 100M. Did 10% participate in this somehow, and each person plant 35 trees across the country?

How would you even get that many trees to plant?

Re: Ethiopia Plants 350M Trees in One Day to Combat Drought and Climate Change

#129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ethipoia, and Africa as a whole, is not Band Aid. Addis Ababa gets more rainfall each year than Washington state.

What Band Aid? I'm talking of the mechanics of keeping 350 million trees alive. That takes effort, and a lot more area besides Addis Ababa. I'm inclined to disbelieve these numbers unless I see some trustworthy non-govt source. Everyone's quoting the minister.

They all don't need to stay alive. They just need some of them to take hold and grow and then spread seeds so that new trees grow, like a normal forest.

The idea is to plant 350 million knowing that a lot won't survive, but that in planting a huge amount, many millions will survive and nature can take over.

Re: Ethiopia Plants 350M Trees in One Day to Combat Drought and Climate Change

#130
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And cross-laminated timber could let us use wood even for bigger construction projects like skyscrapers and bridges. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross-laminated_timber

wooden skyscrapers seem like good candidates for devastating fires

I'm no expert, but from what I heard CLT can achieve fire resistance similar to concrete. (Measured in minutes it can withstand a particular heat.)

These sources are far from unbiased, but nevertheless:

http://www.greenspec.co.uk/building-design/crosslam-timber-f...

https://www.woodworks.org/wp-content/uploads/presentation_sl...

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