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Why we don't use Galileo's last name (2009)

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Re: Why we don't use Galileo's last name (2009)

#101

Post by poizan42 »

klez wrote: post #65
DoreenMichele wrote: post #42

I worked in insurance for over five years. One of the more common reasons we had to send out HIPAA notification letters was due to relatives in the same city with similar or identical names getting claims processed under the wrong policy. These were very often two male relatives -- father and son, twin brothers, cousins. They sometimes even lived on the same street. There's also this story about two women with the sa…

Here in Italy we are given a Codice Fiscale at birth, which is a string of 13 characters derived by 3 letters of the last name, 3 letters of the first name (usually these 6 letters are all consonants, but there are exceptions for names like Anna), 2 digits, a letter and two other digits representing the birth day, one letter and the digits representing the birthplace an one last letter which is a checksum. These are…

Your are lucky. Here in Denmark we have the CPR-number (det Centrale Person Register - the Central Person Register). Unfortunately this number is all to often used as authentication so is supposed to be kept secret. This is of course terribly broken and they get leaked all the time - also they are stamped onto everybody's national health insurance card[0]...

[0]: It's the "999999-9996" on https://i.imgur.com/GscmMjX.jpg

Re: Why we don't use Galileo's last name (2009)

#102

Post by yxhuvud »

egeozcan wrote: post #27
Iv wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a stand up comedian of Algerian descent explaining that situation when the French administration tries to do the census of their colony. The custom was to use your father's and grandfather's name as a name. Problem is, many people, including brothers would have the most popular name (I think it was Mohammed). Having a Mohammed, son of Mohammed, grandson of Mohammed was common. So the French admninistration…

Atatürk (the founder of the Turkish Republic) made surnames mandatory as a reform to be compatible with Europe (he was very pro-Europe) and this was in 1934. Everyone got to pick their own surnames. Luckily people hesitated to pick Mohammed because the word for last name in Turkish translates to "name of lineage" and that'd be a big claim (also I've heard that it wasn't allowed not to put a target on non-muslims' bac…

Did he have any children? That is, do you have any Atatürks running around today?

Re: Why we don't use Galileo's last name (2009)

#103

Post by yxhuvud »

NeedMoreTea wrote: post #29
Iv wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep seeing people from US and UK equating IDs with totalitarianism. Why? I don't follow the reasoning here. I believe all Americans have a social security number, right? And all passport holders have a de-facto global UID (but not everyone has a passport and bi-nationals may have several) I don't see what this enables that would be impossible without.

The UK has no requirement for ID. The old WW2 ID was abolished in the early 50s as an infringement of civil liberties. The idea being that a citizen can go about their lawful business without interruption unless suspected of something. IDs were being asked for by police and others as a matter of course rather than of suspicion. A passport or driving licence forms a de facto ID, but both of those are voluntary, and th…

You may not have any requirement for ID, but to actually function in the society you need one. So in practice you do need one.

As for carrying them, yeah, that should not be necessary.

Re: Why we don't use Galileo's last name (2009)

#104

Post by CarlHoerberg »

poizan42 wrote: post #101
klez wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here in Italy we are given a Codice Fiscale at birth, which is a string of 13 characters derived by 3 letters of the last name, 3 letters of the first name (usually these 6 letters are all consonants, but there are exceptions for names like Anna), 2 digits, a letter and two other digits representing the birth day, one letter and the digits representing the birthplace an one last letter which is a checksum. These are…

Your are lucky. Here in Denmark we have the CPR-number (det Centrale Person Register - the Central Person Register). Unfortunately this number is all to often used as authentication so is supposed to be kept secret. This is of course terribly broken and they get leaked all the time - also they are stamped onto everybody's national health insurance card[0]... [0]: It's the "999999-9996" on https://i.imgur.com/GscmMjX.…

Where is the sole number used for authentication? We got the same number in Sweden but the number is not secret, you need it combination with something else like an ID, signature, digital signature etc.

Re: Why we don't use Galileo's last name (2009)

#105

Post by jobigoud »

camillomiller wrote: post #50

In Italy it’s quite common to go with Galileo Galilei, I would say we use name surname most of the time when we mention him. Maybe it has to do also with how it rolls out of the tongue nicely for us.

In France we say "Galilée". Not sure if it's referring to first or last name.

Re: Why we don't use Galileo's last name (2009)

#106

Post by dcbadacd »

poizan42 wrote: post #101
klez wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here in Italy we are given a Codice Fiscale at birth, which is a string of 13 characters derived by 3 letters of the last name, 3 letters of the first name (usually these 6 letters are all consonants, but there are exceptions for names like Anna), 2 digits, a letter and two other digits representing the birth day, one letter and the digits representing the birthplace an one last letter which is a checksum. These are…

Your are lucky. Here in Denmark we have the CPR-number (det Centrale Person Register - the Central Person Register). Unfortunately this number is all to often used as authentication so is supposed to be kept secret. This is of course terribly broken and they get leaked all the time - also they are stamped onto everybody's national health insurance card[0]... [0]: It's the "999999-9996" on https://i.imgur.com/GscmMjX.…

In Estonia we have an personal identification code, it is never used as authentication, only for differentiating between people, we have Estonian ID card for authentication and identification.

Re: Why we don't use Galileo's last name (2009)

#107

Post by wkearney99 »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #42

I worked in insurance for over five years. One of the more common reasons we had to send out HIPAA notification letters was due to relatives in the same city with similar or identical names getting claims processed under the wrong policy. These were very often two male relatives -- father and son, twin brothers, cousins. They sometimes even lived on the same street. There's also this story about two women with the sa…

My father (a lawyer) and I shared first and last Names, and a middle initial. Local jury commission kept sending notices for him to attend, with increasing levels of threat. I called and told them "he's dead" and they said "prove it".

So after many failed calls and letters including the death certificate, and now threat of warrant being issued, I had to act. It's not like a cop at the door is going to care that the middle NAMES are different.

I took his cremated remains to their office. Thumped the box down on the counter and said, "You keep demanding he show up, so here he is." I cracked open the box and the woman about lost it and dashed off. Her supervisor showed up and I explained my frustration. They guaranteed it'd be handled. We never saw any notices again.

Fast forward 20 years and a friend is an attorney practicing in a nearby county. A case of someone failing to appear for jury duty comes up (warrant served). Judge says "unless someone brings your dead remains to the office, you're not getting out of jury duty".

My old man would have been absolutely DELIGHTED to have entered local folklore, on both counts.

Re: Why we don't use Galileo's last name (2009)

#108

Post by mgkimsal »

mindcrime wrote: post #53
DoreenMichele wrote: post #42

I worked in insurance for over five years. One of the more common reasons we had to send out HIPAA notification letters was due to relatives in the same city with similar or identical names getting claims processed under the wrong policy. These were very often two male relatives -- father and son, twin brothers, cousins. They sometimes even lived on the same street. There's also this story about two women with the sa…

Very true. I've experienced a bit of this first-hand. Growing up, I, my father, and my paternal grandfather all shared the same first name and last name, and all lived within a couple of miles of each other (my father and I obviously lived in the same residence a big chunk of my childhood, and grandpa lived just a short hop away). Our mail (and gosh knows what else) got mixed up all the time. To make it even worse, I…

now I'm dying to call you and ask for $FIRST_NAME...

Re: Why we don't use Galileo's last name (2009)

#109

Post by afiori »

Iv wrote: post #13
vpzom wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Hopefully one day we have a UID for humans[…] that sounds really dangerous

I keep seeing people from US and UK equating IDs with totalitarianism. Why? I don't follow the reasoning here. I believe all Americans have a social security number, right? And all passport holders have a de-facto global UID (but not everyone has a passport and bi-nationals may have several) I don't see what this enables that would be impossible without.

> And all passport holders have a de-facto global UID (but not everyone has a passport and bi-nationals may have several)

Mostly agree with your point, but for the decades to come in this case it would be better to keep IDs of different nations separate.

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