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Paris breaks all-time high temperature as deadly heat wave grips Europe

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Re: Paris breaks all-time high temperature as deadly heat wave grips Europe

#171
post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Famine is our future. In the USA, we are already locking up climate refugees, many children, in cages. Funnily enough, I think this would actually be justified if climate change was going to cause imminent famine as you're suggesting. Given the choice between having the population of the US undergo a mild famine while to the south there's a famine beyond living memory (thanks to preventing climate-motivated migrati…

> Famine, when it comes, will affect the rest of the world far more than it will the US, Canada, and Russia. USA has had the biggest impact on climate in the last 100 years and is responsible for the bulk of climate emissions. In other words, the rest of the world will starve because of us and somehow we can justify building walls to protect ourselves. If there is a thing as "evil" it most certainly is that.

> In other words, the rest of the world will starve because of us

I think that when it comes to total impact on the ability of the rest of the world to feed itself, the US is probably pretty far in the black. Yes the contribution to climate change is negative, but the Green Revolution [0] is almost certainly very, very positive. Improved agricultural tech, including GMO crops, have fed a lot of people around the world.

0: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Revolution

Re: Paris breaks all-time high temperature as deadly heat wave grips Europe

#172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If the Green New Deal is what they'd actually attempt to do, we're fucked. No, we'd be making progress toward eliminating the growth of CO2 in the atmosphere, but making it slower than if they'd also embrace nuclear power. > making sure that Africa never industrializes Is that even part of the public debate? I mean, outside of Ron Paul's newsletters or something equally crazy?

> No, we'd be making progress toward eliminating the growth of CO2 in the atmosphere, but making it slower than if they'd also embrace nuclear power. Ehhhh... We might be making progress on eliminating the growth of CO2 in the atmosphere from the US , but that's a rather different statement. Unless you can get everyone else to agree to emissions restrictions far more restrictive than the Paris Agreement, we'd be wors…

> We might be making progress on eliminating the growth of CO2 in the atmosphere from the US, but that's a rather different statement

That's not a different statement. Making progress in (subtask of A) means we are making progress in (A). Besides, it's not like everyone else isn't making lots of progress too.

Re: Paris breaks all-time high temperature as deadly heat wave grips Europe

#173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No, we'd be making progress toward eliminating the growth of CO2 in the atmosphere, but making it slower than if they'd also embrace nuclear power. Ehhhh... We might be making progress on eliminating the growth of CO2 in the atmosphere from the US , but that's a rather different statement. Unless you can get everyone else to agree to emissions restrictions far more restrictive than the Paris Agreement, we'd be wors…

> We might be making progress on eliminating the growth of CO2 in the atmosphere from the US, but that's a rather different statement That's not a different statement. Making progress in (subtask of A) means we are making progress in (A). Besides, it's not like everyone else isn't making lots of progress too.

> Making progress in (subtask of A) means we are making progress in (A).

Not always, but I will grant that it likely does in the case of emissions reduction. (consider a thought experiment - US reduces emissions from power generation by building a ton of coal plants over the border in Mexico)

The point was more that the Green New Deal can only address a small fraction of future world emissions, and that fraction is not large enough to prevent catastrophe. That doesn't mean that we shouldn't reduce emissions! Just that unilateral reductions might not be the way to go. (Imagine the US unilaterally giving up nukes in the 1960s and then trying to convince the Soviet Union to do the same - it would be far less likely than agreeing to both disarm at the same time. IMO negotiations on emissions reduction are like this)

Re: Paris breaks all-time high temperature as deadly heat wave grips Europe

#174

Climate change isn’t disputed by logic. It’s being disputed by the commercial entities that are protecting their $billion/$trillion industries who, otherwise, would have to face big losses. We all know the industries that are negatively impacting the environment. Their selfish stakeholders have managed to successfully create a reality distortion field of denial. This article, with lack of mentioning global warming, i…

It's pretty short-sighted to blame individual companies for providing what the people want: Affordable energy and transportation. You see what happens if you drive up prices for gasoline in France: People start rioting in the streets. If you had gasoline prices like that in the US, whole states would stop functioning. Also, most CO2 emissions are from countries where people are far poorer than in developed nations. A…

Please see https://ourworldindata.org/uploads/2018/10/CO2-emissions-by-....

86% of CO2 emissions are created by people in upper-middle income and high income groups.

Re: Paris breaks all-time high temperature as deadly heat wave grips Europe

#175
post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty short-sighted to blame individual companies for providing what the people want: Affordable energy and transportation. You see what happens if you drive up prices for gasoline in France: People start rioting in the streets. If you had gasoline prices like that in the US, whole states would stop functioning. Also, most CO2 emissions are from countries where people are far poorer than in developed nations. A…

Please see https://ourworldindata.org/uploads/2018/10/CO2-emissions-by-... . 86% of CO2 emissions are created by people in upper-middle income and high income groups.

This doesn't contradict what I said. The OECD defines "upper-middle-income" countries as 4000$-12,000$. This includes major developing countries such as Russia, Brazil and China, all of which have far lower incomes than the US or most of Europe.

For reference:

http://datatopics.worldbank.org/sdgatlas/archive/2017/images...

Re: Paris breaks all-time high temperature as deadly heat wave grips Europe

#176
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rate could also mean people/year instead of %/year.

growth in people/year is surprisingly constant over the last 50 years https://www.google.com/publicdata/explore?ds=d5bncppjof8f9_&...

Oh, interesting.
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